Referendum on Family & Care

[CharlieManson]

SF (MLMD) said yesterday they would NOT run the same referendum again. No party in their right mind would!

lol

More flip flops than a party at RTE.

Soundy Sinn Fein were very vocal on endorsing the Yes vote and although I don’t think anyone should be sacked for it like I think O Gorman should, SF have made right fools of themselves coming out after saying the wording from the government was a joke.

Why didn’t they say it before it was emphatically shot down?

They’ve lost a lot of credibility recently imo.

Im ToTaLly AgAiNsT tHiS tHiNg I wAs AlL fOr TwO dAyS aGo.


Some operators lol

 

[El Guapo]

Renua dont exist, they changed their name to something else last year. Maybe youre thinking of Aontu?

The Centre Party of Ireland.

Nothing like a snappy rebrand to light a fire in the belly of the electorate

 

[CharlieManson]

The Centre Party of Ireland.

Nothing like a snappy rebrand to light a fire in the belly of the electorate

Lol, things are bad when Eddie Hobbs jumps ship.

 

[SoundMan]

Ml

Renua dont exist, they changed their name to something else last year. Maybe youre thinking of Aontu?

As for calling me a shill. Ive been hugely critical of all government parties stance on this and I slated Micheal Martins performance on Primetime earlier on in the week.

I dont vote or form my opinions along party lines. You should try it some time. People might stop labelling you a cultist.

You cut a ridiculous figure trying to solely blame the government when the idiot Shinners (along with Soc/Dems and Labour) were pushing for a yes vote.


'Change' my arse. They've proven themselves just the same as the idiots who came up with these ridiculous amendments




View attachment 30687



Ffs that moron McDonald is on the record saying she would rerun the referendum the public just rejected in record numbers.
Just as out of touch as the government parties


View attachment 30688

Yes Aontu

MLMD said only yesterday that SF will not have a rerun of it. It lost by a landslide.

Now you can keep posting all the out of context pre-referendum SF photos you like and try contrast it with what the Govt parties are saying now post referendum but the inescapable truth is:
All of the Govt Parties suppressed the AG’s advice - including your beloved FF
The Govt Parties came up with the flawed wording
The Govt Parties guilotined the debate on the flawed wording
The Government Parties thought it best to spend circa 20Million Euro on this farce

The opposition parties didn’t cover themselves in glory, but it’s silly to try to apportion blame for this in equal measure on the opposition who’d only get outvoted in the Dáil anyway and then get portrayed in the media as being anti women/care


The fact that you posted up a list of those you thought shared the blame including MLMD, Pantybliss, and Fergus Findlay while excluding Micheál Martin who’d been front and centre in devising, facilitating, and promoting this referendum speaks volumes about you Dan. When you were scatterguning your criticism to all and sundry you took very careful aim not to criticise your hero Micheál

 

[CharlieManson]

Now you can keep posting all the out of context pre-referendum SF photos you like and try contrast it with what the Govt parties are saying now post referendum but the inescapable truth is:

How is this 'out of context'?



Was there another referendum on that I missed?


You seem to be fixated on my tribute post to the 70s Norwegian commentator. I just picked a few random names, it was a joke. Substitute Michael for Mary Lou if it makes you happier, you loon

 

[fed up]

Again Dan Shill wants to lump Sinn Fein in with the govt on this referendum humiliation. SF were involved to the same degree as Labour Party, Social Democrats, and People Before Profit trying to make what they saw as the best of a bad lot on the Govt’s forced through wording.

Yes all the opposition parties (Renua aside) messed up, but nothing on the scale
Of culpability of the Goverment parties who came up with their own wording; guilotined it through the Dáil preventing opposition debate; and lied to the opposition about the AG’s advice.

And now members of this GFFG Govt want to prioritise finding who leaked the AG’s opinion.

Still, at least Dan has moved on a bit from where he wanted to absolve his hero Micheál Martin completely of any culpability when he went so far as to name a list including the likes of Pantybliss as being responsible - but not MM

SF also voted to approve the hate speech bill in the Dail. Legislation which was brought by Helen McEntee, whose husband is a senior executive with puberty blocker manufacturer AbbVie, lol.
Did you challenge a possible conflict of interests there by the minister bringing this forward?

 

[rebs23]

Amazing how a lot of the analysis is about how really we didn’t know why or what we were voting on, the campaign didn’t educate us, etc. Maybe just maybe people want the government to run the country and gave a two fingers to woke bullsit?

 

[Crankycorner]

So they publicly declared support for it and ran a mile from it?

Ok

Yes. Very few FF, FG and SF politicians actively campaigned for a Yes Yes.

 

[CharlieManson]

Good analysis in the Sindo

Colum Kenny: Politicians of all shades toyed with inserting bulls**t into the Constitution

Here, in a word, is why the double referendum was lost. People thought it was BULLSHIT. Apologies for the rude word. I did use the politer “vacuous” in the Sunday Independent on January 14 when calling for a No result.

m.independent.ie

'Here, in a word, is why the double referendum was lost. People thought it was BULLSHIT


Apologies for the rude word. I did use the politer “vacuous” in the Sunday Independent on January 14 when calling for a No result.


However, politicians who supported the proposals may simply be too out of touch to understand what happened — unless it’s spelled out in big, bold letters.
The public have had enough empty posing and not enough good governance.


This was not a “failure of communications” or “messaging”. You can put lipstick on a pig but it’s still a pig. And people saw through the public relations and virtue signalling. The emperor had no clothes.
And here is who is to blame for the expensive shambles:


1. The Government

Fine Gael, Fianna Fáil and the Greens all peddled nonsense. The wording was hopeless, the arguments in favour sometimes dishonest. Ireland’s Constitution was maligned by ministers claiming for example that it said a woman’s place is in the home. It does not.


2. The opposition

Sinn Féin and the Labour Party failed to provide good, honest opposition. Their job was to oppose a bad proposal, not to try and have it both ways.

3. The NGOs

The National Women’s Council and other bodies said the proposal was not really what they wanted. But they supported it anyway!

Their “step-in-the-right direction” mantra was at best politically naive and at worst reflected a cosy funding relationship with the Government.

The referendum was not what the Citizens’ Assembly or disability rights groups wanted. It was the second time in a row an assembly recommendation was cherry-picked to support a lesser proposal. The first time was in respect to blasphemy.

Attempts to portray those wanting a No vote as backward were offensive and counter-productive. I met a number of people voting No on Friday who did so despite the fact bishops wanted a No vote. People made up their own minds. Women did not find their fundamental rights strengthened.

And then there was “durable relationship”, which the Dáil failed to define in legislation. At least judges will not have the whole mess foisted on them to sort out now.

Schools were shut so polling could take place on International Women’s Day instead of on Saturday. Will the Government ensure these children get back a valuable day’s lost education? Or is that not included in its support for “caring families”?

Ironically, today is Mother’s Day. They chose this weekend to try to cut from the Constitution its recognition of the State’s responsibility to endeavour to ensure that mothers are not forced by economic necessity to work outside the home to the neglect of children.

Smart move, guys.

But the good news is the proposed changes were never necessary in order for Dáil Éireann to introduce new supports for carers and families.

All those things that ministers promised would be possible after the referendum can be done anyway. Or was that “vacuous” too?

 

[CharlieManson]

Yes. Very few FF, FG and SF politicians actively campaigned for a Yes Yes.

How can you say that when every party leader and their senior ministers were rolled out pushing for a yes vote?

Sorry but thats simply an incorrect statement.