The Official Munster Rugby Thread™

How bad boy

Full Member
I think a semi final berth in the European cup is probably the scope of our potential to be quite honest.

Munster have an operating budget of about 3 mill. Thats dwarfed by sides like Clermont & Toulouse .

Van Graan isn't much of a coach to be honest and we could be playing a more expanise game but I dont think we would be doing a whole pile better.

Shitting the bed to Scarlets in the pro 14 final in 2017 was pretty dire but is Rassie a terrible coach because of it?

For all the sadness of his untimely passing the appointment of Foley was the moment that really shattered Munster fortunes in recent years. The side fell off a cliff.

I think when you look at it objectively we cant compete with other sides backing. (We had private individuals funding Snynam and De Allende).

Prendegast and Rowntree will at least freshen things up. Lets hope we can improve next year but there are positives this year with great wins against Exeter and Ulster away.
When it comes to funding, I think you have to be a little careful.

So Leinster essentially have a large budget because so many of their team are on international contracts. They almost certainly effectively have a massive budget compared to the other provinces.

That said though, I'm not convinced more funding would help a great deal, don't think Munster has had much of an attrition problem.

Not certain how important money is here, other than buying in talent. Leinster's success very much is not on buying in talent, Munster are arguably more dependent on external talent and it isn't really working out. I wonder if the sheer size of their squad is the outcome of having more funding (cause they can focus their funding on their B team, whereas Munster, Ulster and Connacht have to focus it on their A team), but it's hard to know for sure.

I think munster have been better this year than last. Not up to Leinster's level but at least not as shit as one of those crappy teams who are not even in the mix at the business end of the season like Bath and going in the right direction.
 
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The Judge

Full Member
Think its a bit over the top tbh.

Munster arnt in the same league with player pick and backing as Leinster.

Look at the schools set up. Pres and Christians are grand but the likes of Blackrock college are more like a university campus. Different planet.

We did very well with an extraordinary core of Irish players in the noughties and we've produced nothing like it since.

Its disappointing we're not winning stuff but losing semis to sides like Saracens and Clermont who were operating off significantly bigger budgets than us is to be expected.

Leinster could put out two top class XVs but shorn of Beirne, POM, De Allende we were well short.

Lets see how we get on in Ravenhill.
No it's not over the top.Not that very long ago we were beating Leinster on a regular basis.Those schools you speak of were always there back then.All of this is on Munster inc and the people who run Munster.Get into the 6 or 7 schools of rugby in Munster and start putting proper structures in place.Because I can tell you straight off that CBS and PBC are not being coached to their full potential and that's where the problems start.Get onboard with those schools and start your academy from there and then you'll start seeing results in 5 years time but not tomorrow.We have wasted 10 years of no change and it will continue until we change the coaching approach and personal within the schools.
 

jeepers

Full Member
I think a semi final berth in the European cup is probably the scope of our potential to be quite honest.

Munster have an operating budget of about 3 mill. Thats dwarfed by sides like Clermont & Toulouse .

Van Graan isn't much of a coach to be honest and we could be playing a more expanise game but I dont think we would be doing a whole pile better.

Shitting the bed to Scarlets in the pro 14 final in 2017 was pretty dire but is Rassie a terrible coach because of it?

For all the sadness of his untimely passing the appointment of Foley was the moment that really shattered Munster fortunes in recent years. The side fell off a cliff.

I think when you look at it objectively we cant compete with other sides backing. (We had private individuals funding Snynam and De Allende).

Prendegast and Rowntree will at least freshen things up. Lets hope we can improve next year but there are positives this year with great wins against Exeter and Ulster away.
I agree. My point about potential is more to do with our ability to play a style that has the potential to get you further, rather than something that has a lower ceiling. And you have to say that winning the URC should have been done in the last five years.
 

jeepers

Full Member
By potential I read it as regard to our rugby ability, as opposed to results.

Agreed with Foley - terrible appointment. I was relieved ROG went abroad to learn his trade.

We'll just have to hope there's something there for him to want to come back to eventually
That's exactly how I meant it, Handy.
 

Hank Scorpio

Full Member
When it comes to funding, I think you have to be a little careful.

So Leinster essentially have a large budget because so many of their team are on international contracts. They almost certainly effectively have a massive budget compared to the other provinces.

That said though, I'm not convinced more funding would help a great deal, don't think Munster has had much of an attrition problem.

Not certain how important money is here, other than buying in talent. Leinster's success very much is not on buying in talent, Munster are arguably more dependent on external talent and it isn't really working out. I wonder if the sheer size of their squad is the outcome of having more funding (cause they can focus their funding on their B team, whereas Munster, Ulster and Connacht have to focus it on their A team), but it's hard to know for sure.

I think munster have been better this year than last. Not up to Leinster's level but at least not as shit as one of those crappy teams who are not even in the mix at the business end of the season like Bath and going in the right direction.

In terms of running the club yeah money is pretty important.

And attracting talent is one of the biggest parts of it.
 

Hank Scorpio

Full Member
I agree. My point about potential is more to do with our ability to play a style that has the potential to get you further, rather than something that has a lower ceiling. And you have to say that winning the URC should have been done in the last five years.

They shat the bed in 2017 against Scarlets. Theyve been nowhere since.

Getting to the semis against Clermont and Saracens was our ceiling for that period imo

I will reserve judgement until we see what Prendegast can do in attack.

Also I certainly dont agree with your man Judge saying we were regularly beating Leinster until recently, that simply isn't the case.
 

Handy Run

Full Member
There's two things being discussed here and being mixed up.

1. Resources
2. Rugby philosophy

We have an embarrassment of resources compared to Connaught yet they play much better rugby than us. I'm not saying we have to spread the ball every time as sometimes Connaught can be a bit naive but we have gone in the opposite direction. So we can't blame the lack of resources for our shite saffer style rugby.

I don't know how deep the bish bosh run into contact or kick it away rot is, but it needs to be rooted out and replaced with some actual rugby because we'll never win on brute strength and/or pashun alone again. Like I said, we were haunted to get that super group together when we did and that's a once in a generation event at best.

Can anyone tell me what kind of rugby is being played in the schools? Last time I saw a Munster schools final I was bored to tears by the 8 man rugby. I hope to fawk that's still not the case.
 

How bad boy

Full Member
In terms of running the club yeah money is pretty important.

And attracting talent is one of the biggest parts of it.
See I'm not sure of that, because it certainly hasn't been a driver of Leinster's success.


Looking at Leinster's squad, they only have one non irish qualified player (Ala'alatoa)

Sure, Gibson-Park and Lowe came over to Leinster, but they weren't top talent when they arrived. Lowe was good but he was basically unknown outside of NZ and wasn't really someone marked as a future All Black. Gibson-Park wasn't even first choice when he arrived
 

Hank Scorpio

Full Member
There's two things being discussed here and being mixed up.

1. Resources
2. Rugby philosophy

We have an embarrassment of resources compared to Connaught yet they play much better rugby than us. I'm not saying we have to spread the ball every time as sometimes Connaught can be a bit naive but we have gone in the opposite direction. So we can't blame the lack of resources for our shite saffer style rugby.

I don't know how deep the bish bosh run into contact or kick it away rot is, but it needs to be rooted out and replaced with some actual rugby because we'll never win on brute strength and/or pashun alone again. Like I said, we were haunted to get that super group together when we did and that's a once in a generation event at best.

Can anyone tell me what kind of rugby is being played in the schools? Last time I saw a Munster schools final I was bored to tears by the 8 man rugby. I hope to fawk that's still not the case.

You'd swear Munster were playing like Fiji when we were winning stuff.

It was 90% kick for the corners and up the jumper rugby.

I agree we can do better but this season has had its high notes too.
 

Hank Scorpio

Full Member
See I'm not sure of that, because it certainly hasn't been a driver of Leinster's success.


Looking at Leinster's squad, they only have one non irish qualified player (Ala'alatoa)

Sure, Gibson-Park and Lowe came over to Leinster, but they weren't top talent when they arrived. Lowe was good but he was basically unknown outside of NZ and wasn't really someone marked as a future All Black. Gibson-Park wasn't even first choice when he arrived

You keep telling yourself that.

Farrell was brought in at centre too. We're not producing any. Goggin was embarrassing at the weekend.

Saying money isnt a huge factor is ridiculous.
 

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