The County Board Complaints Thread

[King Dino 34]

Out of curiosity, who here would leave their current club to form a new one?
Especially one in the same parish?

Done and worth it. I probably wouldnt be involved within GAA as i am now, on the club committee, served as a selector for both the hurlers and footballers, coached the u21s, minors and 14s and 15s and 16s over the years. Also a referee, if we hadnt have formed a new club none of this would have happened for me.

 

[red&blue]

That is a big dream and not realistic in building a sustainable club with that timeline.

its realistic, just alot of work up front

Year 1: U6s and promoting in the Junior infants in the designated schools. Focus on getting a solid start. If you try to field teams from U7 to U12 in year 1, it is destined to fail as they won't be able to recruit enough players and it gets off to a negative start immediately. If you can sustain one group at U6 for a year, the motivation will be high to push on the following year
Year 2: U7 & U6.
Keep going up 1 year each time with that first group that started.

Yeah nothing wrong with this approach either except you would be going in your designated primary schools where the older players are playing with a different club

All they would need for the first 7 years is a green field with basic toilets and training facilities. Wouldn't even need a full size pitch.
For year 8, when they are playing U14, they would then need to be getting access to a full size pitch, but after 8 years and hopefully 8 good groups of parents, fundraising/goodwill would be achievable.
Slow and steady.

again nothing wrong with that suggestion, they are the details that would have to be ironed out if the new (or struggling) club was to be sustainable long term

 

[red&blue]

Thanks for this RnB. Something like this, maybe on a timeline closer to Reservedcitizen's suggestion, might be the best option.

possibly

In practice I wonder about designating schools for certain clubs. First, who would have the authority?

the county board would appoint a full time coach who would go into the designated schools of the new club and work on the ground with the new club. All kids in that school play with the new club

Second, with some of the small clubs you mention I wonder how effective it would be, at least in the short term. Take Dripsey - are there enough primary schools close to their pitch to make the scheme work?

Ballincollig has 4 primary boys schools as far as i can see, 3 relatively big schools of 250+ and one smaller one of 70+ in Classes Lake which is very near Dripsey GAA Pitch so let 2 schools align with Dripsey and 2 stay with Ballincollig

However I wonder would a cap on membership at each age work better? Say clubs can register 40 players per year and the rest can join the second club in the area. But that 2nd club must have the support of a full time GDA to help the club grow

None of this is to say it can't work, or shouldn't be tried. At the v least it should be discussed now. Put another way: player retention in some of the biggest clubs is a problem for those clubs, for the players lost and for Cork GAA as a whole, and it is all but impossible for those clubs to solve this problem by themselves (even if you think that in some cases they could be doing better).

agreed, and we have to be open to change

 

[Killyoursons]

the county board would appoint a full time coach who would go into the designated schools of the new club and work on the ground with the new club. All kids in that school play with the new club

Agreed on the need for a full-time coach. I assume your thinking is that the CCB would designate which schools go with the new/small club. That would have to be sold v carefully to the local community though. You're talking in some cases about children who are already with one club, or who's brothers or friends are already there, being assigned to another. It's possible but would need serious buy-in.

Ballincollig has 4 primary boys schools as far as i can see, 3 relatively big schools of 250+ and one smaller one of 70+ in Classes Lake which is very near Dripsey GAA Pitch so let 2 schools align with Dripsey and 2 stay with Ballincollig

That example actually illustrates the kinds of practical issues which would need to be skirted. There's one (smaller) school close to Dripsey. To make your suggestion work a school closer to Ballincollig would need to be assigned to Dripsey as well. That could face some amount of push-back. If you had boys attending Togher NS, I doubt you'd be happy to learn that they'd be handed over to, say, Ballyphehane.*

It's not just Dripsey/Ballincollig either. A quick look at that map posted a few pages back suggests there'd be a similar problem for Rochestown and Douglas.















* But at least not to Imokilly

 

[red&blue]

Agreed on the need for a full-time coach. I assume your thinking is that the CCB would designate which schools go with the new/small club. That would have to be sold v carefully to the local community though. You're talking in some cases about children who are already with one club, or who's brothers or friends are already there, being assigned to another. It's possible but would need serious buy-in.

absolutely! im not saying my ideas are not without issues, they are just my ideas on how to grow participation in larger urban areas

as i said on a previous post you could introduce a cap on the amount of players that any club can register per year, somewhere around 30/35 maybe? Any other boys them join the second club in the area

You are probably only talking about Ballincollig, Douglas, Sars, Carrigaline having the numbers to support a second club, possibly Midleton too

That example actually illustrates the kinds of practical issues which would need to be skirted. There's one (smaller) school close to Dripsey. To make your suggestion work a school closer to Ballincollig would need to be assigned to Dripsey as well. That could face some amount of push-back.

agreed, we are not starting with a blank canvas here, but i think we are all agreed something along these lines should be done

If you had boys attending Togher NS, I doubt you'd be happy to learn that they'd be handed over to, say, Ballyphehane.*

of course i wouldnt, but my club would be no different to anywhere else, if it needed to happen it should happen

Just so its on the record here, a second club should be fully functioning in our area, alot of reasons why its not but the lack of foresight by the board is probably the biggest one

It's not just Dripsey/Ballincollig either. A quick look at that map posted a few pages back suggests there'd be a similar problem for Rochestown and Douglas.

Douglas are a great club but because of lack of space they cant cooe with the numbers they get. That area of the city is crying out for a second club. Have you ever heard that discussed by the board? me neither

* But at least not to Imokilly

Theres no fear of Imokilly and the huge numbers they have at Pairc Ui Uibh Mac Coille every Saturday morning

 

[peopleluas]

I love the contributions here on ideas for radically increasing player participation. Of course there are all sorts of obstacles, and some ideas mightn't work and could even have unintended consequences - trying is a risk, not trying is a bigger risk. But as a great man once said "it always seems impossible until it's done", and it sure seems like even though we all have loyalties to our own clubs, that an awful lot of us have a greater loyalty to increased player participation in general, and the good things that this should bring for boys and young (and perhaps not so young) men.

(Girls and women too - but at present this thread is about the GAA Cork County Board and until the upcoming amalgamation of the sporting bodies I want to stay on topic for this thread)

 

[Killyoursons]

absolutely! im not saying my ideas are not without issues, they are just my ideas on how to grow participation in larger urban areas

as i said on a previous post you could introduce a cap on the amount of players that any club can register per year, somewhere around 30/35 maybe? Any other boys them join the second club in the area

You are probably only talking about Ballincollig, Douglas, Sars, Carrigaline having the numbers to support a second club, possibly Midleton too

agreed, we are not starting with a blank canvas here, but i think we are all agreed something along these lines should be done

of course i wouldnt, but my club would be no different to anywhere else, if it needed to happen it should happen

Just so its on the record here, a second club should be fully functioning in our area, alot of reasons why its not but the lack of foresight by the board is probably the biggest one

Douglas are a great club but because of lack of space they cant cooe with the numbers they get. That area of the city is crying out for a second club. Have you ever heard that discussed by the board? me neither

Theres no fear of Imokilly and the huge numbers they have at Pairc Ui Uibh Mac Coille every Saturday morning

That's a v fair response, thanks.

I've been stressing the need for local buy-in, but I think the way to get that started might be with the CCB acknowledging there is a problem here which needs to be addressed, which is in some ways the mirror image of the problems which led to underage amalgamations. Acknowledge that and invite proposals. There's a chance that a consensus won't be reached, but without an open discussion which the powers that be take seriously, there'll be no chance at all.

 

[red&blue]

That's a v fair response, thanks.

I've been stressing the need for local buy-in, but I think the way to get that started might be with the CCB acknowledging there is a problem here which needs to be addressed, which is in some ways the mirror image of the problems which led to underage amalgamations. Acknowledge that and invite proposals. There's a chance that a consensus won't be reached, but without an open discussion which the powers that be take seriously, there'll be no chance at all.

this has to come from the top, it wont work otherwise, but you’re right, the board would have to try bring everyone with them rather than force this on anyone, if they can.

Alas i dont see it happening, im not even sure if the board see these issues to be homest. Rather than start looking at amalgamations, which i think is the right thing to do, maybe they should be having a broader review including what we are discussing

 

[peopleluas]

To cater for the very important tradition and club loyalty of the very large clubs we're discussing here, and to optimize resources (playing pitches and the like) perhaps the following approach might be interesting?

For a start: Once a club reaches premier senior in any grade, and has more than X (value of X to be determined) registered players turning 8 in the calendar year, then the club must field geographically-partitioned teams. Starting with that age group, and continuing up with them all the way up to and including adulthood so that after say 14 years or more there are partitioned teams at every level. The club may also field club-wide teams at the following grades, and a player playing for a partitioned team may also play for the club-wide team provided the club-wide team is in a higher grade competition (in practice these will be the best players):

• A single adult team
• A single u18 team, perhaps...

So take Ballincollig for example. You would end up with a number of Ballincollig teams eventually all the way up to adulthood, say:

• Coolroe, Ballincollig
• The Village, Ballincollig
• Powder Mills, Ballincollig
• Carriginarra, Ballincollig

They would all play in Ballincollig colours, except when playing each other (in which there would be a toss to determine which team plays with the away Ballincollig jerseys).

And you'd still have an overall Ballincollig team at adulthood. Almost like a divisional team, but of course with far deeper loyalty.

I probably have the details of this all wrong, but you see the general idea, and perhaps somebody can improve on it.

 

[red&blue]

To cater for the very important tradition and club loyalty of the very large clubs we're discussing here, and to optimize resources (playing pitches and the like) perhaps the following approach might be interesting?

For a start: Once a club reaches premier senior in any grade, and has more than X (value of X to be determined) registered players turning 8 in the calendar year, then the club must field geographically-partitioned teams. Starting with that age group, and continuing up with them all the way up to and including adulthood so that after say 14 years or more there are partitioned teams at every level. The club may also field club-wide teams at the following grades, and a player playing for a partitioned team may also play for the club-wide team provided the club-wide team is in a higher grade competition (in practice these will be the best players):

• A single adult team
• A single u18 team, perhaps...

So take Ballincollig for example. You would end up with a number of Ballincollig teams eventually all the way up to adulthood, say:

• Coolroe, Ballincollig
• The Village, Ballincollig
• Powder Mills, Ballincollig
• Carriginarra, Ballincollig

They would all play in Ballincollig colours, except when playing each other (in which there would be a toss to determine which team plays with the away Ballincollig jerseys).

And you'd still have an overall Ballincollig team at adulthood. Almost like a divisional team, but of course with far deeper loyalty.

I probably have the details of this all wrong, but you see the general idea, and perhaps somebody can improve on it.

this sounds a bit like the old u13 D competitions in the city which were in fact u12 teams with local names representing their club

The Barrs had 3 teams who were based in different areas of our community Glashhen (based in Wilton and Glasheen), Dyefield (based in Togher and Ballyphehane and Bandon Road (based in The Lough and Greenmount)

The matches between these 3 teams were as fierce as any Barrs v Glen game!

Its a very interesting concept and one i think has alot of merits, it retains the connection to the club while giving all players game time which means less drop off

I think this could be something worth trying up to under 15 with club teams then being formed at u16.

But all clubs would have to do the same and enter the appropriate amount of teams for their players and there be no connection to playing premier senior, treat everyone the same

The prblem I see with it is for instance my own club the Barrs would struggle to have enough for 2 teams on the age never mind 3. So what happens the weaker players who invariably will be the ones to lose out?

Fair play!