Jesus lads, 'tis looking like BREXIT!

How bad boy

Full Member
I don't have that info to hand but if you consider a countries currency to act as a form of proxy for its economic health then you will see EUR/GBP is more or less where it was 6 years ago, so I would think on a comparative basis with Europe not a hell of a lot has changed. I suppose you could argue the UK would have been roaring ahead without Brexit but all that is, is an opinion, I'm not sure political ineptitude makes a huge difference to an overall economy (only an opinion also) as the markets generally act as a deterrent to sheer stupidity and act accordingly i.e forcing a U-Turn on Truss's recent budget.

As for not mentioning Brexit, my apologies, I was mislead by the thread title!!
I think that market correction of government incompetence is highly limited.

There is no doubt the UK is underperforming relative to its peers on GDP terms:
2019 - today, UK GDP 0.4% down, OECD average 3.7%, G7 average 2.5%

The UK historically has generally been ahead of G7 average growth rates, but that changed in 2017 and hasn't regained that position:

Same is true for the EU/Eurozone, UK used to be one of the highest growers, it no longer is:

There does appear to be a long term drop in GBP vs EUR since Brexit but not catastrophically so. Really depends your baseline is, looks bad if you compare it to 2015-H1 2016, about standard for 2009 - 2014. Complete car crash territory compared to pre 2009 (where 1.4 was about the range for GBP/EUR)

Government ineptitude is definitely a factor in both wellbeing and growth. Tories don't seem to understand fiscal multipliers. Nor do they seem to be able to run a public utility competently.
The NHS isn't underfunded by historic standards, but incompetent leadership and moronic allocation of capital (especially pumping large amounts of money into private suppliers instead of properly funding core services) is clearly not working. Exact figures are hard to come by, because the government isn't transparent on figures. Not surprising considering Matt Hancock gave his pub landlord £40 million for Covid work that was almost entirely wasted.

How bad boy

Full Member
Lovely contrast here to exactly illustrate my point, two stories on the front page of the Guardian this evening:

Tory peer given large amounts of money for PPE contracts which were then siphoned off.
"Lady Mone’s support helped the company, PPE Medpro, secure a place in a “VIP lane” the government used during the coronavirus pandemic to prioritise companies that had political connections. It then secured contracts worth more than £200m.
The leaked documents, which were produced by the bank HSBC, appear to contradict that statement. They state that Mone’s husband, the Isle of Man-based financier Douglas Barrowman, was paid at least £65m in profits from PPE Medpro, and then distributed the funds through a series of offshore accounts, trusts and companies.
In September 2020, Barrowman was paid at least £65m in “profits” from the PPE deal, the HSBC report states. It states that money was transferred in two instalments to the Warren Trust, one of Barrowman’s Isle of Man trusts, using the reference “Distribution”.

From there, transfers totalling £45.8m were made to Barrowman’s personal HSBC Isle of Man bank account. That account, in turn, transferred £28.8m in October 2020 to the Keristal Trust, the beneficiaries of which, bank records indicated, were Mone and her children, the report states."

Ambulance crews could not respond to almost one in four 999 calls last month – the most ever – because so many were tied up outside A&Es waiting to hand patients over, dramatic new NHS figures show.

An estimated 5,000 patients in England – also the highest number on record – potentially suffered “severe harm” as a result of waiting so long either to be admitted to A&E or just to get an ambulance to turn up to help them at all.

Ambulance officers warned that patients were dying every day as a direct result of the delays because the service could no longer perform its role as a “safety net” for people needing urgent medical help.
“The ambulance service is in meltdown. These figures show that it is on its knees and close to collapse as a result of vacancies, underfunding, morale being at a very low ebb and demand for ambulance care having doubled to 14m calls a year since 2010,” said Rachel Harrison, the national secretary of the GMB union, which represents 15,000 staff in English ambulance services.
The AACE report also discloses that:
  • 18% of ambulance handovers took more than an hour last month, when the NHS target is 15 minutes – a nine-fold increase on the 2% seen in October 2019.
  • The average handover time was 42 minutes, up 12 minutes from October 2021 – and up 23 mins from Oct 2020.
  • The number of one, two, three and 10-hour handovers was the highest ever recorded.
  • Delays exposed an estimated 41,000 patients to potential harm, of whom about 5,000 were put at risk of or experienced “severe harm”, including death
The BBC as usual completely avoiding mentioning Brexit, it's still Ukraine and Covid as the reasons;

All countries are/were affected by Ukraine and Covid.

All countries in the E.U. & G7 are powering ahead of the U.K.

Brexit is the elephant in the room, they promoted this nightmare and now they are stuck with it as politically they have to do so even though it is a complete ongoing omnishambles for the U.K.
They have to get the gammon moron vote but once Starmer gets in the rejoin the single market work will begin.
Kier Starmer last week said that they have to "Make Brexit Work" and does not plan to re-joining the S.M. or C.U. if elected P.M.

It is a daft policy but necessary to pull in Tory voters in the red wall seats.

Brexit is dead anyway and they are just stuck with a big pile of rubble and the bill.

Even the gammon GB News viewers know which way things are going.


Full Member
Starmer is so afraid of repeating the Brexit mistake of the last election that he is now more glued to making Brexit work than Rishi is.

Second question on QT last night - is the RMT going to ruin another Christmas?

Bruce doesn't even pretend anymore.

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