Cyclists

[Chara021]

There are lots of rules and regulations regards using the roads. And rightly so. Most people try to be diligent in up holding those rules.

Unfortunately there is also a lot of human error. People are distracted, people are tired , people are human and don't have marvel character abilities /reflexes or super human awareness 24/7.

They have normal human awareness which is not exactly foolproof and is sometimes subject to lapse and deteriation on any given day. For whatever reason. And that reason doesn't hold any water because the driver is always responsible. That's the law.

I remember Judge from Wanderly Wagon singing the Safe Cross Code. The emphasis being on the pedestrian also going through a set of rules. To keep ourselves safe. Why? Because drivers can't be trusted to see everything and do everything right at the very moment you might be crossing the road. You had to be aware of this fact. Having the right of way on a pedestrian crossing isn't a foregone conclusion. No matter what the rules are.

You're not wrong in proceeding to cross on the green man, but you're also not entirely safe if you ignore the Safe Cross Code. And if you get knocked down you are still not wrong , the driver is. That's the law.

I drove a motorbike for a time. Had all the high Vis , the headlight was always on, I drove practically with eyes at the back of my head because it was obvious sometimes car drivers just didn't see me. It's the same with pedestrians. Sometimes they just don't get seen. Is that right?? No of course not.

But it's the reality. And roads / town junctions are overloaded. And they are busy and they are messy. And people are people.
Fragile , flawed and always potential victims to a one split second mistake, or a two second mistake, or a three second mistake. On all sides. All road users. Everyone needs to be diligent.

Nobody sets out to kill someone on the road. And nobody sets out to not be careful when surrounded by mere humans driving vehicles.

It's just sometimes the rules and regulations don't always protect us.

 

[Chara021]

so are the "fuck em I own a car, so I know best" crowd

Really?? Seriously?? Like Really?? You actually think this??

 

[yellowsliotar]

People are distracted, people are tired , people are human and don't have marvel character abilities /reflexes or super human awareness 24/7.

Don't get behind the wheel then.
You are driving a vehicle that weights 2 tonne or more and kills.
It doesn't take super human awareness to stop at a red light. It's basic driving 101

 

[Chara021]

Don't get behind the wheel then.
You are driving a vehicle that weights 2 tonne or more and kills.
It doesn't take super human awareness to stop at a red light. It's basic driving 101

And yet you seem to expect super human.

I don't know what rock you've been living under if you think that people with basic driving skills or even those with excellent driving skills for that matter don't make mistakes.

You're just making a fool of yourself now Yellow, with your constant 'but but but he should have stopped' argument.

The real discussion on this thread was the sentence he got. And as someone already said that's down to the justice system.

If you consider this man should have got the mandatory sentence what sentence should a person get who has been convicted more than once and repeatedly drives under the influence of drink / drugs etc.? Because the circumstances/ facts of one case is not the same as the other.

Let me hazard a guess what your answer would be given the attitude you have displayed on this thread.

Circumstance ( 1) : Person who kills someone due to driving with undue care and attention with no prior convictions, no speeding, drink/ drugs involved.
Sentence : Mandatory Jail Time & a lifetime ban from driving. ( This is what you think is a deserving sentence).

What about the next circumstance?

(2) Person who kills someone due to speeding , driving under the influence of drink/ drugs and with more than one conviction or as is often the case several convictions.
Sentence: ?? The same as Number 1?

Or given your mentality perhaps death by lethal injection you would deem a fitting sentence for circumstance ( 2).

Am I right?

 

[El Guapo]

Really?? Seriously?? Like Really?? You actually think this??

I believe it about as much as I believe the post to which I was replying

"All of the driving geniuses, know all's and hang em high brigade are out tonight."

But if you want evidence of the pervading attitude the general public has towards vulnerable road users read through this thread from the start.

Grown men in their 40s, 50s and 60s patting each other on the back for blasting the horn at some cyclist who dared to go about their day and use the roads or boasting about punishment passes. Because a cyclist may have held up traffic for all of 30 seconds. Even that is a cardinal sin to many.

The same posters clubbed together and voted as Idiot if the year another poster who argues (perhaps quite fervently) against the orthodoxy and in favour of vulnerable road users.

I don't disagree with any of your previous post.

But its fairly clear to me that the hierarchy of road users has been lost in the fog of all the day to day distractions you have spoken about. Pedestrians are at the top, Followed by cyclists, Motor cyclists and Horse Riders, Car drivers and HGVs there is no ambiguity.

All the shitty driver behaviour I described (scooting through Pedestrian lights, not stopping at zebra crossings etc) are to that boy being killed while crossing at a "safe" location, What a person taking Cocaine at a party is to a Gangland Killing in Dublin.

They are all linked, I would argue, they are directly linked.

Of course that man did not set out to kill that boy. I'm sure he will regret whatever distraction or impatience that led him to run a red light for the rest of his days but we all need to sit up and think about it. It did not happen in isolation

 

[Chara021]

I believe it about as much believe the post to which I was replying

"All of the driving geniuses, know all's and hang em high brigade are out tonight."

But if you want evidence of the pervading additude the general public has towards vulnerable road users read through this thread from the start.

Grown men in their 40s, 50s and 60s patting each other on the back for blasting the horn at some cyclist who dared to go about their day and use the roads or boasting about punishment passes. Because a cyclist may have held up traffic for all of 30 seconds. Even that is a cardinal sin to many.

The same posters clubbed together and voted as Idiot if the year another poster who argues (perhaps quite fervently) against the orthodoxy and in favour of vulnerable road users.

I don't disagree with any of your previous post.

But the its fairly clear to me that the hierarchy of road users has been lost in the fog of all the day to day distractions you have spoken about. Pedestrians are at the top, Followed by cyclists, Motor cyclists and Horse Riders, Car drivers and HGVs there is no ambiguity.

All the shitty driver behaviour I described (scooting through Pedestrian lights, not stopping at zebra crossings etc) are to that boy being killed while crossing at a "safe" location, What a person taking Cocaine at a party is to a Gangland Killing in Dublin.

They are all linked, I would argue, they are directly linked.

Of course that man did not set out to kill that boy. I'm sure he will regret whatever distraction or impatience that led him to run a red light for the rest of his days but we all need to sit up and think about it. It did not happen in isolation

Fair enough, it just seemed like a sweeping statement.

Not everyone in cars considers they are the hierarchy. Or would needlessly beep at vulnerable road users.

And perhaps not everyone reading this thread are of the hang ' em high brigade either.

And you are correct. There is a mean attitude and bad behaviour attached to this.

Yellows attitude towards that driver is much the same as what you describe some people's attitude towards cyclists , pedestrians etc.

It's just wrong minded. Its a blatant lack of understanding and an unyielding intolerance that does nothing other than compound the bad attitude and the bad behaviour.

All in all I think in reality people do try to be responsible road users.

My point and general stance is that the human element sometimes gets in the way.

As for the forum posters you describe. Don't get me started.?

 

[Meridian]

I believe it about as much as I believe the post to which I was replying

"All of the driving geniuses, know all's and hang em high brigade are out tonight."

But if you want evidence of the pervading attitude the general public has towards vulnerable road users read through this thread from the start.

Grown men in their 40s, 50s and 60s patting each other on the back for blasting the horn at some cyclist who dared to go about their day and use the roads or boasting about punishment passes. Because a cyclist may have held up traffic for all of 30 seconds. Even that is a cardinal sin to many.

The same posters clubbed together and voted as Idiot if the year another poster who argues (perhaps quite fervently) against the orthodoxy and in favour of vulnerable road users.

I don't disagree with any of your previous post.

But its fairly clear to me that the hierarchy of road users has been lost in the fog of all the day to day distractions you have spoken about. Pedestrians are at the top, Followed by cyclists, Motor cyclists and Horse Riders, Car drivers and HGVs there is no ambiguity.

All the shitty driver behaviour I described (scooting through Pedestrian lights, not stopping at zebra crossings etc) are to that boy being killed while crossing at a "safe" location, What a person taking Cocaine at a party is to a Gangland Killing in Dublin.

They are all linked, I would argue, they are directly linked.

Of course that man did not set out to kill that boy. I'm sure he will regret whatever distraction or impatience that led him to run a red light for the rest of his days but we all need to sit up and think about it. It did not happen in isolation

Good post, do you drive ?

 

[El Guapo]

Good post, do you drive ?

Yes I Drive, and I Walk, Run, Cycle and use the Bus.

I am far from unique in that I would imagine it's true of most people to a greater or lesser degree.

 

[yellowsliotar]

And yet you seem to expect super human.

I don't know what rock you've been living under if you think that people with basic driving skills or even those with excellent driving skills for that matter don't make mistakes.

You're just making a fool of yourself now Yellow, with your constant 'but but but he should have stopped' argument.

I don’t expect super human as again It isn’t super human to obey traffic signals, again it is basic driving 101.
As for making a fool of myself, that of course is your opinion and after your posts on this thread to date, it is one have very little regard for.

You seem to have issues with losing your temper and resorting to insults in this discussion as evidenced particularly with your exchange with @Happyhonkaman.

 

[Chara021]

I don’t expect super human as again It isn’t super human to obey traffic signals, again it is basic driving 101.
As for making a fool of myself, that of course is your opinion and after your posts on this thread to date, it is one have very little regard for.

You seem to have issues with losing your temper and resorting to insults in this discussion as evidenced particularly with your exchange with @Happyhonkaman.

Oh please ?Change the record Yellow.

Interesting you didn't answer my question. ?