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Cork Hurlers - Part 2

Very surprised watching as a neutral that Kingston didn't get on at all. Especially as some of the forwards were finding it tough going and Kingstons confidence would have been high after the clare game. Doubht Limerick backs would have been looking forward to chasing him around
I just don't think that Kingston is the sub for a wet, windy day in a war of attrition.
There wasn't enough space or loose ball for him to thrive or make an impact.
 
Is Brian O O'Sullivan down the pecking order for one of the hopefully temporarily vacant positions in midfield?
Can only recall him making the bench v Waterford and starting v Galway in Salthill.
 
Is Brian O O'Sullivan down the pecking order for one of the hopefully temporarily vacant positions in midfield?
Can only recall him making the bench v Waterford and starting v Galway in Salthill.
I actually live in north cork and know lot of lads from duhallow and the majority of them that I’m talking to can not believe Hugh o Connor getting game time before Brian o Sullivan. Obviously the management going by training or what ever but just thought it was interesting.
 
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I actually live in north cork and know lot of lads from duhallow and the majority of them that I’m talking to can not believe Hugh o Connor getting game time before Brian o Sullivan. Obviously the management going by training or what ever but just thought it was interesting.
Hugh O' Connor looks like a Ben O Connor pet project - he definitely gets game time at every possible opportunity. Will probably come good in time. Has shown patches for sure but still with L plates as we saw on Sunday in the cauldron when he was hooked
 
Sticking harnedy on the edge of the square would have been a total waste of fucking time, if you were there you would have
Realised the wind was serious and Collins couldn’t clear the limerick half back line , in fact his puck outs were dropping in front of them and they were attacking the ball, neither team against the wind could hit ball into the edge of the square.
Kingston in a game like that I’m not sure at all, he won’t win puckouts it’s not his game, he needs space and it wasn’t there Sunday.
Putting connolly in there in fucking waste of time as well so. At least Harnedy will die with his boots on.
 
100% Crusty.
When I left Páirc Uí Chaoimh on Sunday I was in a bad mood, angry and disappointed.

But by the time I got home and dried off I started to see it in a different light very similar to what you mention above.
I hope our players and management learn from this loss, and I think they will
Most of us take a few days to read the reports, look at the podcasts and review the stats and then judge the game and where we are.

I think that both Limerick and Cork will take positives and negatives from this game.

The stats reveal quite a lot.

Cork won 5 of their 15 contested restarts. 3 went out of play. This resulted in Cork creating just over 50% of the scoring chances that Limerick created.
Kiely prides himself on Limericks scoring accuracy but they were wasteful and we had 1 wide.

You can interpret stats any way you want but I think that Cork can take more consolation in that they were roundly beaten in almost every metric but Limerick had to rely on James Owens to get the win. (I'll come back to refs later on)

Limerick had a full deck but Cork were missing Fitzy and Robbie O Flynn.

Yes, you can argue that Limerick won't be so wasteful from play and placed balls again but Cork simply have more areas to improve upon.

Take Barry Walsh for example - He's a generational talent but erred in taking the ball into contact with Limerick (on one occasion, he tried to get tru 3 defenders) That's a relatively easy fix - with the expert use of the free hand by Limerick, you can't go into contact so you need to usually look to go away from goal and offload to a free man. If he practices with 2 men on him, doing Limerick type challenges, he'll quickly learn this. I expect this issue to be sorted.

Another relatively easy fix is to work on our restarts - we can and will improve the next day we face Limerick (I expect we will)

I think Cork will learn more but Limerick will see their mistakes as well. Both will improve but I hope that Cork have more areas that they can fix.

Back to refs - It's really getting serious now. Owens reffed the 2 recent Cork/Limerick clashes completely differently. In the RR, he let everything go and we were wondering what was going on in the first 10 minutes - he did the opposite in the MF.
He had a huge impact on the result, the last day. The free against Connolly that led to a point was a poor call and the free that led to Limericks goal was also a wrong call IMO. He missed 2 obvious fouls on Hayes & Buckley (Ben referenced these) and was very unfair to SOD resulting in his substitution. We can trot out the usual drivel that Cork have only got themselves to blame but IMO, the ref made mistakes that cost Cork the game. The free count was 18-13 - the opposite to the RR game.

To illustrate how close it was, we hit the post with a 65 and Connolly was unfairly pinged, Byrnes pointed.

There is now a big issue with officials - players/management don't know what's a foul - the biggest problem is use of the free hand - Limerick have perfected this. It seems that a player can impede a little but will get pinged if he over does it. The ref must decide how much impeding is OK. That's farcical. We have every scenario now. The Tyler Walsh free for all. The Owens ping everything but with Owens it can be different game to game. The MF last year was a joke. Tyler did not ref the first half and Limerick full back line had a field day. He pinged more in the 2nd half and then Owens came in and pinged most fouls. 3 types of reffing in one game. Talk about the lack of consistency.

IMO - the GAA must grasp the nettle and make a few tough decisions. Either allow use of the free hand to impede an opponent or not. All refs must be encouraged to apply the rules consistently. We have Kennedy from Tipp that blows everything. Tyler lets everything go and Owens can do either (within a few weeks)

I challenge any GAA big wig to claim that the rules of hurling are being applied on a consistent basis.

But returning to Cork v Limerick - Pat Ryan thinks that Clare could have a big say yet. I disagree and expect Limerick to hammer Clare.
Cork have a few injuries now (TOC & TOM) but the squad depth should cover this. It looks like a semi v Galway.

I'd see that as 60:40 for us and I expect we will face Limerick again in July.

There are too many variables to call it now but I'd see it as almost 50:50 with Limerick being slight favourites due to their dominant HB line. Ben will be trying for a plan to allow us deal with their HB line and his success could yet decide who takes Liam Mac
 
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Most of us take a few days to read the reports, look at the podcasts and review the stats and then judge the game and where we are.

I think that both Limerick and Cork will take positives and negatives from this game.

The stats reveal quite a lot.

Cork won 5 of their 15 contested restarts. 3 went out of play. This resulted in Cork creating just over 50% of the scoring chances that Limerick created.
Kiely prides himself on Limericks scoring accuracy but they were wasteful and we had 1 wide.

You can interpret stats any way you want but I think that Cork can take more consolation in that they were roundly beaten in almost every metric but Limerick had to rely on James Owens to get the win. (I'll come back to refs later on)

Limerick had a full deck but Cork were missing Fitzy and Robbie O Flynn.

Yes, you can argue that Limerick won't be so wasteful from play and placed balls again but Cork simply have more areas to improve upon.

Take Barry Walsh for example - He's a generational talent but erred in taking the ball into contact with Limerick (on one occasion, he tried to get tru 3 defenders) That's a relatively easy fix - with the expert use of the free hand by Limerick, you can't go into contact so you need to usually look to go away from goal and offload to a free man. If he practices with 2 men on him, doing Limerick type challenges, he'll quickly learn this. I expect this issue to be sorted.

Another relatively easy fix is to work on our restarts - we can and will improve the next day we face Limerick (I expect we will)

I think Cork will learn more but Limerick will see their mistakes as well. Both will improve but I hope that Cork have more areas that they can fix.

Back to refs - It's really getting serious now. Owens reffed the 2 recent Cork/Limerick clashes completely differently. In the RR, he let everything go and we were wondering what was going on in the first 10 minutes - he did the opposite in the MF.
He had a huge impact on the result, the last day. The free against Connolly that led to a point was a poor call and the free that led to Limericks goal was also a wrong call IMO. He missed 2 obvious fouls on Hayes & Buckley (Ben referenced these) and was very unfair to SOD resulting in his substitution. We can trot out the usual drivel that Cork have only got themselves to blame but IMO, the ref made mistakes that cost Cork the game. The free count was 18-13 - the opposite to the RR game.

To illustrate how close it was, we hit the post with a 65 and Connolly was unfairly pinged, Byrnes pointed.

There is now a big issue with officials - players/management don't know what's a foul - the biggest problem is use of the free hand - Limerick have perfected this. It seems that a player can impede a little but will get pinged if he over does it. The ref must decide how much impeding is OK. That's farcical. We have every scenario now. The Tyler Walsh free for all. The Owens ping everything but with Owens it can be different game to game. The MF last year was a joke. Tyler did not ref the first half and Limerick full back line had a field day. He pinged more in the 2nd half and then Owens came in and pinged most fouls. 3 types of reffing in one game. Talk about the lack of consistency.

IMO - the GAA must grasp the nettle and make a few tough decisions. Either allow use of the free hand to impede an opponent or not. All refs must be encouraged to apply the rules consistently. We have Kennedy from Tipp that blows everything. Tyler lets everything go and Owens can do either (within a few weeks)

I challenge any GAA big wig to claim that the rules of hurling are being applied on a consistent basis.

But returning to Cork v Limerick - Pat Ryan thinks that Clare could have a big say yet. I disagree and expect Limerick to hammer Clare.
Cork have a few injuries now (TOC & TOM) but the squad depth should cover this. It looks like a semi v Galway.

I'd see that as 60:40 for us and I expect we will face Limerick again in July.

There are too many variables to call it now but I'd see it as almost 50:50 with Limerick being slight favourites due to their dominant HB line. Ben will be trying for a plan to allow us deal with their HB line and his success could yet decide who takes Liam Mac
Malachy Clerkin did a minute by minute analysis on the refereeing performance on Sunday.

His findings vindicate Corks view on the referee. Of the 50/50s, missed decisions and incorrect decisions he counted 12-5 in Limericks favor.

Thats a huge factor in determining the outcome.

If it was 12-5 the other way around we would have won by 7 or 8 points!
Just 50/50 parity would have seen us win by 3 or 4 probably.
Which is the way the game was going a couple times until Owens decided to give everything to Limerick for two 10 minute spells.

So in total, 12 dubious calls for Limerick. Thats huge. And thats what we saw but good to have this data to back it up.

And thats before considering Malachy Clerkin is no fan of Cork.
 
Most of us take a few days to read the reports, look at the podcasts and review the stats and then judge the game and where we are.

I think that both Limerick and Cork will take positives and negatives from this game.

The stats reveal quite a lot.

Cork won 5 of their 15 contested restarts. 3 went out of play. This resulted in Cork creating just over 50% of the scoring chances that Limerick created.
Kiely prides himself on Limericks scoring accuracy but they were wasteful and we had 1 wide.

You can interpret stats any way you want but I think that Cork can take more consolation in that they were roundly beaten in almost every metric but Limerick had to rely on James Owens to get the win. (I'll come back to refs later on)

Limerick had a full deck but Cork were missing Fitzy and Robbie O Flynn.

Yes, you can argue that Limerick won't be so wasteful from play and placed balls again but Cork simply have more areas to improve upon.

Take Barry Walsh for example - He's a generational talent but erred in taking the ball into contact with Limerick (on one occasion, he tried to get tru 3 defenders) That's a relatively easy fix - with the expert use of the free hand by Limerick, you can't go into contact so you need to usually look to go away from goal and offload to a free man. If he practices with 2 men on him, doing Limerick type challenges, he'll quickly learn this. I expect this issue to be sorted.

Another relatively easy fix is to work on our restarts - we can and will improve the next day we face Limerick (I expect we will)

I think Cork will learn more but Limerick will see their mistakes as well. Both will improve but I hope that Cork have more areas that they can fix.

Back to refs - It's really getting serious now. Owens reffed the 2 recent Cork/Limerick clashes completely differently. In the RR, he let everything go and we were wondering what was going on in the first 10 minutes - he did the opposite in the MF.
He had a huge impact on the result, the last day. The free against Connolly that led to a point was a poor call and the free that led to Limericks goal was also a wrong call IMO. He missed 2 obvious fouls on Hayes & Buckley (Ben referenced these) and was very unfair to SOD resulting in his substitution. We can trot out the usual drivel that Cork have only got themselves to blame but IMO, the ref made mistakes that cost Cork the game. The free count was 18-13 - the opposite to the RR game.

To illustrate how close it was, we hit the post with a 65 and Connolly was unfairly pinged, Byrnes pointed.

There is now a big issue with officials - players/management don't know what's a foul - the biggest problem is use of the free hand - Limerick have perfected this. It seems that a player can impede a little but will get pinged if he over does it. The ref must decide how much impeding is OK. That's farcical. We have every scenario now. The Tyler Walsh free for all. The Owens ping everything but with Owens it can be different game to game. The MF last year was a joke. Tyler did not ref the first half and Limerick full back line had a field day. He pinged more in the 2nd half and then Owens came in and pinged most fouls. 3 types of reffing in one game. Talk about the lack of consistency.

IMO - the GAA must grasp the nettle and make a few tough decisions. Either allow use of the free hand to impede an opponent or not. All refs must be encouraged to apply the rules consistently. We have Kennedy from Tipp that blows everything. Tyler lets everything go and Owens can do either (within a few weeks)

I challenge any GAA big wig to claim that the rules of hurling are being applied on a consistent basis.

But returning to Cork v Limerick - Pat Ryan thinks that Clare could have a big say yet. I disagree and expect Limerick to hammer Clare.
Cork have a few injuries now (TOC & TOM) but the squad depth should cover this. It looks like a semi v Galway.

I'd see that as 60:40 for us and I expect we will face Limerick again in July.

There are too many variables to call it now but I'd see it as almost 50:50 with Limerick being slight favourites due to their dominant HB line. Ben will be trying for a plan to allow us deal with their HB line and his success could yet decide who takes Liam Mac
Outstanding post.

Another easy fix on our behalf is trusting the bench more, I am fixated on this issue from Sunday.
Heavy day in rain, heavy pitch, heavy legs.
Outside the forced SOD substitution at about 40 mins our next sub was 66 mins which is simply too little too late.
The days of finishing intercounty games with 16/17 players of which 2 players get token minutes is not good enough game or player management.
People can argue all they want that the 15 did ok to well (which I agree to an extent) but as I said the days of playing an intercounty game with only 16/17 players are gone, never mind a huge battle in a Munster Final against Limerick - we needed to freshen up the forward line at 50 mins max 55 mins- 3 forwards did not score from play. That's a backs dream and it was also Limerick's dream on the day which contributed to their win.

You also mention some fine margins such as 2 point swing or Connolly's 65 to Byrnes pointing. I completely agree with fine margins that's life and something we cannot control.

Speaking of controllables BOC himself needs to start focusing more on what we can actually control and less about refs, last year I did say Pat Ryan needed to be more vocal especially after the 2024 final, and BOC came in and was a breath of fresh air and I welcomed it but now it's starting to be sour grapes in my opinion.
Coleman cleaned up some of BOC's comments from Sunday in yesterdays interview he gave which was brilliant.
Kiely played a smart game during week, 'our approach will be help the ref he has it tough out' (paraphrasing) and he was in the ref and 4th officials ear Sunday and he seemed to get away with it and benefit of doubt. BOC constantly criticising the refereeing standards is now a broken record going on since Feb/March.
 
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