Giddy Gooners

[KolaKubes]

Utd produced football tonight the equal of anything you lot have since Arsene showed up so I dont want to hear any more from you about being the team of the purists. Shush. ;)

[TrickyBrick]

against watford at old trafford........

[KolaKubes]

against watford at old trafford........

Oh the irony of that one.

Arsenal made their reputation beating no-mark opposition.

Sure, their invincibles foundered on the mighty rock that is Phil Neville.:rolleyes:

[Edmund Blackwater]

against watford at old trafford........
Requiring a typicallydodgy penalty and an og.
Manyoo are the bestest.

[TrickyBrick]

your bored id say are ya?

Arsenal have showed there capable of playing that way against any opposition, see Arsenal V ManUtd at Old trafford this season, im off to bed but i like the style of football utd play but not dont use tonight as an example of how they can play beautiful football cus Watford are extremely poor.

[KolaKubes]

see Arsenal V ManUtd at Old trafford this season

Dearey me, that old chestnut. 4-5-1, Kusczak barely involved.

Anyway, goodnight boy.

[KolaKubes]

Requiring a typicallydodgy penalty and an og.
Manyoo are the bestest.

Bestestestest.

The Larsson and Rooney goals were spectacular though.

[st finnbar]

Requiring a typicallydodgy penalty and an og.
Manyoo are the bestest.

now listen here kid, did you watch the match, im guessing no, since you were busy tugging away to liverpool past glories , utd were shit hot tonight, and to be fair chelsea were quite good as well, see that , i will say when the other team plays well, now tugger, thats your new name:D , you go back to wumming

[HappyMonday83]

Anyone who bothered to watch the champions league final last year knows arsenal can play like that against the best. I'm sick of people saying arsenal always bottle it on the big nights. ;)

[shtopem_floppen]

Requiring a typicallydodgy penalty and an og.
Manyoo are the bestest.

Ye seeing the defender with a handful of the back of Solskjaer's shirt was iffy alright. And the other two brilliantly worked goals don't really count

[Rebelred]

A good win for United but nothing more than was expected really. Nice finishes by both Larsson and Rooney too.

[RonnyB]

It was a good win considering Fergie didnt have Giggs, Scholes, Evra & Saha in the 16 & Richardson & O'Shea played. Hearing on the radio who he left out & that Richardson was playing sent back memories of the Sunderland 0-0 on Good Friday last year.

The goals by Rooney & Larsson were well taken & at least they killed of the game rather than being wastefil like they have been in the last month or so.

[homer jay]

A good win for United but nothing more than was expected really. Nice finishes by both Larsson and Rooney too.

fair play rr, a bit of perspective

[POL]

embarrassing. is it any wonder ManYooers are treated the way they are on this forum

[Rebelred]

embarrassing. is it any wonder ManYooers are treated the way they are on this forum

well in fairness POL, there's many a fan on here, not just United btw, who get carried away with the odd result. If I'd a penny for everytime the Pool have "turned a corner" with a result against bottom half of the table opposition I'd be a rich man indeed.
As Homer Jay said, lets keep things in perspective, anything less than 3 points, at home to the worst team in the league, would not be acceptable for United.
But that's all it is, 3 points, another win, still 6 clear and top.

[Sound]

well in fairness POL, there's many a fan on here, not just United btw, who get carried away with the odd result. If I'd a penny for everytime the Pool have "turned a corner" with a result against bottom half of the table opposition I'd be a rich man indeed.
As Homer Jay said, lets keep things in perspective, anything less than 3 points, at home to the worst team in the league, would not be acceptable for United.
But that's all it is, 3 points, another win, still 6 clear and top.

Turning a corner is a totally different thing from it being ON.

And ON it certainly is.

[EL TORO]

now listen here kid, did you watch the match, im guessing no, since you were busy tugging away to liverpool past glories , utd were shit hot tonight, and to be fair chelsea were quite good as well, see that , i will say when the other team plays well, now tugger, thats your new name:D , you go back to wumming


Was at the game last night, and i'd have to disagree with the shit hot statement. Utd were'nt so hot in the first half. A lot of misplaced passes, bad link up play etc. It took a deserved penalty to break a woeful Watford. In the second half Utd got their act together and were a lot more cohesive. Larsson's introduction had a powerful effect on the game. Had Utd being playing a team of greater quality they would'nt have been too happy with the first half's display. That said there's no doubt in my mind now that Fergie will sign off with another title this year. On another point, There's no competition when it comes to who plays better football in the prem. Arsene's boys are awesome.

[Rebelred]

Turning a corner is a totally different thing from it being ON.

And ON it certainly is.

oh you'd better bring it!

[KolaKubes]

well in fairness POL, there's many a fan on here, not just United btw, who get carried away with the odd result. If I'd a penny for everytime the Pool have "turned a corner" with a result against bottom half of the table opposition I'd be a rich man indeed.
As Homer Jay said, lets keep things in perspective, anything less than 3 points, at home to the worst team in the league, would not be acceptable for United.
But that's all it is, 3 points, another win, still 6 clear and top.

Who said anything about the result?

Case in point, Carrick was absolutely outstanding and, in large part, you'll not see anything of his handiwork on MOTD.

El Toro is presenting himself as objective in this because he's an Everton fan. As far as the so-called neutrals are concerned, Utd winning the title over Chelsea is merely the lesser of the evils. It will only take Gary Neville prancing around OT with the trophy to knock people out of that.

Arsenal, for many many years now, have been the choice of the neutral. It's the height of self-delusion to imagine that non-Utd fans are objective in this.

The most satisfying aspect of this season for me has been a return to RTE panellists discussing how bad the opposition are when Utd thump someone 3-0. That's when I knew we were back with a bang.

Utd have never got the critical acclaim for the fabulous attacking, entertaining football they've provided over the years in the Premiership. No more than you'd get anything other than grudging admiration for Arsenal's football from proper Utd fans.

That is the way of things but please do not be trying to paint yourself as a neutral.

[KolaKubes]

Anyone who bothered to watch the champions league final last year knows arsenal can play like that against the best. I'm sick of people saying arsenal always bottle it on the big nights. ;)

Heh heh, you mean the campaign where Arsenal ground out 1-0 wins playing one up top before finally getting found out in the final? ;)

Bolton wouldn't even play that cynically. :D

[Rebelred]

Who said anything about the result?

Case in point, Carrick was absolutely outstanding and, in large part, you'll not see anything of his handiwork on MOTD.

El Toro is presenting himself as objective in this because he's an Everton fan. As far as the so-called neutrals are concerned, Utd winning the title over Chelsea is merely the lesser of the evils. It will only take Gary Neville prancing around OT with the trophy to knock people out of that.

Arsenal, for many many years now, have been the choice of the neutral. It's the height of self-delusion to imagine that non-Utd fans are objective in this.

The most satisfying aspect of this season for me has been a return to RTE panellists discussing how bad the opposition are when Utd thump someone 3-0. That's when I knew we were back with a bang.

Utd have never got the critical acclaim for the fabulous attacking, entertaining football they've provided over the years in the Premiership. No more than you'd get anything other than grudging admiration for Arsenal's football from proper Utd fans.

That is the way of things but please do not be trying to paint yourself as a neutral.
I'm not painting myself as a neutral KK, Im a United fan, I've just always been an extremely pessimistic one! That's how I am, I call things how I see them and right now we're deservedly top of the league but I think we will have to up it again to stay there for the rest of the season.

[RonnyB]

Case in point, Carrick was absolutely outstanding and, in large part, you'll not see anything of his handiwork on MOTD.

I wouldnt get carried away with him being outstanding against Watford although I think he shipped too much criticism earlier in the season and has been very solid over-all.

The most satisfying aspect of this season for me has been a return to RTE panellists discussing how bad the opposition are when Utd thump someone 3-0. That's when I knew we were back with a bang.
.

Agreed. I read the RTE website on a regular basis and Dunphy used bang on in his Champs League column about United becoming un-stuck in the Prem. He's been waiting for it all year & was quick to comment when United lost to Arsenal, Copenhagen & Celtic. Its only this week he's decided to write up. The only surprise was he didnt post his column after they United lost at Arsenal last week.

[KolaKubes]

I'm not painting myself as a neutral KK, Im a United fan, I've just always been an extremely pessimistic one! That's how I am, I call things how I see them and right now we're deservedly top of the league but I think we will have to up it again to stay there for the rest of the season.

Ah no, I was referring to El Toro. I know you're sort sure, wrap themselves in a protective shield of pessimism until a trophy's won and then run around demented! :D My gooner brother's like that actually, it's very amusing.

I don't think you can get away with pessimism just now though. 6 (7 points really) clear of Chelsea who have a seemingly crocked captain and need to beat Utd at Stamford Bridge to have any chance.

[Rebelred]

Ah no, I was referring to El Toro. I know you're sort sure, wrap themselves in a protective shield of pessimism until a trophy's won and then run around demented! :D My gooner brother's like that actually, it's very amusing.

I don't think you can get away with pessimism just now though. 6 (7 points really) clear of Chelsea who have a seemingly crocked captain and need to beat Utd at Stamford Bridge to have any chance.

something like that, my season picks up when we hit the magical 42 point relegation safety mark... everything after that is a bonus :D

Don't forget Chelski appear to have lost Cashley for the rest of the season now

[KolaKubes]

I wouldnt get carried away with him being outstanding against Watford although I think he shipped too much criticism earlier in the season and has been very solid over-all.


Ah get the opposition thing out of your mind. What he did last night was finally look like a guy that could pick up the little ginger maestro's baton. Range of passing with both feet. I'll put it this way, he brings everything to the central midfield role that Gerrard doesn't and vice versa. Carrick is never going to be a dynamic, goalscoring midfielder, a leader per se, but he could still be a great player for us and teamed with the right partner over the next few years, Utd could be very good in that area once again.

I don't happen to think Scholes is a good partner for him though, they're a bit too similar for my liking. The O'Shea partnership last night was interesting, I don't rate the guy, but he seemed to bring out the best in Carrick on the night.

[homer jay]

jesus kola, there really is no hope for you

[KolaKubes]

Don't forget Chelski appear to have lost Cashley for the rest of the season now

I didn't. I'm just worried that they'll regain their defensive solidity without that overrated tosser in the team!

In saying that, he does have pace and it's gotten him through facing Ronaldo well, in fairness. That game, if it proves to be crucial, could be all about how his replacement fares, Ronaldo is becoming so important to how Utd tick.

[KolaKubes]

jesus kola, there really is no hope for you

Ah, say it ain't so HJ.

[exiledcorkman]

United were very good last night in patches, overall, there isn't a huge difference between United and the Gooners on top form although I'll give it to the Gooners that they play great free flowing passing football.. I find it hard to appreciate it at times though as they have such a cynical edge to them throughout the team in relation to kicking someone one minute and doing a swan dive the next...

At the end of the day, the league table doesn't lie, United are top on merit, as it stands, they have been a better team then arsenal for the fist 20 odd games of the season. Tell me that Wenger wouldn't swop the two wins over United for the Premiership Trophy??

going back to the comment earlier about united needing a penalty and an og to break down watford... the penalty was stonewall and the og a result of a whipped in cross after great passing football that Ronaldo would have stuck anyway had Doyley not done it for him. The passing and movement for the other two goals was outstanding...

Arsenal play better passing football but United are the better overall team in the league this season... disagree with the league table.. go on...!!!!! :wink:

[Actin The Sham]

Anyone who bothered to watch the champions league final last year knows arsenal can play like that against the best. I'm sick of people saying arsenal always bottle it on the big nights. ;)

Was that the match that Barcelona won?

[EL TORO]

Who said anything about the result?

Case in point, Carrick was absolutely outstanding and, in large part, you'll not see anything of his handiwork on MOTD.

El Toro is presenting himself as objective in this because he's an Everton fan. As far as the so-called neutrals are concerned, Utd winning the title over Chelsea is merely the lesser of the evils. It will only take Gary Neville prancing around OT with the trophy to knock people out of that.

Arsenal, for many many years now, have been the choice of the neutral. It's the height of self-delusion to imagine that non-Utd fans are objective in this.

The most satisfying aspect of this season for me has been a return to RTE panellists discussing how bad the opposition are when Utd thump someone 3-0. That's when I knew we were back with a bang.

Utd have never got the critical acclaim for the fabulous attacking, entertaining football they've provided over the years in the Premiership. No more than you'd get anything other than grudging admiration for Arsenal's football from proper Utd fans.

That is the way of things but please do not be trying to paint yourself as a neutral.

Seriously Kola, Watford were woeful last night. Any team worth their salt would have seen them off. Being a neutral I went along to watch some well played football, because i'm not getting that at Goodison at the moment and the Emirates is a bit of a trek for a midweek game. As i stated earlier Utd were ordinary in the first half and really only turned it on in the last half hour. As for media bias against Utd, try being an Evertonian, Im sure Bill Kenwright went round to Rupert Murdoch's gaff on xmas day and pissed on his presents. Although we're on the box more this season, we are definitly not on Sky's Christmas card list.

[Sound]

oh you'd better bring it!

Oh, I did.

I went there.

Remember where you first heard it because it's definitely on.

:cool:

[homer jay]

Ah, say it ain't so HJ.

afraid so. with all due respect, this has gone way past your normal delusional self.

[RonnyB]

Ah get the opposition thing out of your mind. What he did last night was finally look like a guy that could pick up the little ginger maestro's baton.

He is missing one thing if he's to be Scholesy's successor. Goals. Scholes when on form has always scored 10 to 15 goals a season & even got 20 in the last title winning side. For me if Fergie partners him with, lets say Hargreaves if he signs, then United are missing a vital threat.

Alright I know Scholes has only 5 goals this year but If he had a Sissoko type alongside I think that figure would increase. Those 'arriving in the box late' goals he made his rep on have vanished more or less barring the goal against the Pool. Its all long range strikes now.

Saying that if Carrick took over the role Scholes has in the team NOW, he wouldnt look out of place at all & I think the £14m mightnt look the bad value it was percieved.

[KolaKubes]

afraid so. with all due respect, this has gone way past your normal delusional self.

My delusion is backed up by the league table, for the moment at least.

And this is not a great Utd side.

Why are Liverpool fans even bothered with this argument, it's not like you lot have ever been connoisseurs of the beautiful game.

[Sound]

My delusion is backed up by the league table, for the moment at least.

And this is not a great Utd side.

Why are Liverpool fans even bothered with this argument, it's not like you lot have ever been connoisseurs of the beautiful game.

Ever?

Really?

[homer jay]

My delusion is backed up by the league table, for the moment at least.

i know engaging you in a meaningful debate is a pointless, i will do it nonetheless.

utd are top, well done you spotted that, i may have underestimate you. being top of the league does not mean you played 'beautiful' football to get there.
example: chelsea over the last two seasons. they didn't play swashbuckling stuff. they were extremely effective in what they did, and totally deserved their titles.And this is not a great Utd side.

Why are Liverpool fans even bothered with this argument, it's not like you lot have ever been connoisseurs of the beautiful game.

you obviously don't watch much football outside of utd games. pool can be bad. they were very bad v utd, everton and others earlier this season. but lately they've been playing very good football. against west ham the other night, they played some great stuff, especially for crouch's goal.

but no, despite independent testimony from el toro (whose word i'd take over yours any day of the week), nobody plays beautiful football like utd do, even if they are playing the worst team in the league, and on their home ground. but then again, as you say, nobody can be independent when judging utd. everyone's biased, right?

[RonnyB]

United are'nt getting credit though for the quality of their collective football. Individuals like Ronaldo & Rooney (at times this season) are the ones pointed out rather than lets say the whole of the Arsenal front 6 are getting.

Take Larsson's disallowed goal against Pompey. Not one mention of the deft ball over the top to him by Gary Neville. Gary fricking Neville like!

Its not as slick as spectacular as Arsenal's but its proving more productive if you go by goals scored. And it isn't boring or dour either. I'd like the way there's a balance to the play & I think if you were to ask any Arsenal fan they'd have killed to have seen that nice contrast to their play earlier in the season when they were trying to walk the ball home. If they had the directness that they are really starting to show now they wouldnt be 25/1 to win the title.

[RonnyB]

Oh and Homer, Crouch's goal the other night was a beaut in fairness.

[POL]

The following phrase comes to mind when reading ronnie Kubes "You can’t make a silk purse from a sow’s ear"

[BlueSkies]

Is this shit for real? It was Watford for fuck sake, a team singled out for relegation before the season even started.

[STEVIEG]

Kola I agree with some of your points (Carrick etc) but this could have been included in the midweek footy thread

Creating a thread after United beat a poor Watford is obviously gonna be understandably annoying for some, Spurs and Liverpool will be a much bigger tests
I don't see why you have to reference Arsenal all the time, who cares? They are 15 points back and out of contention (though looking good for a cup or two)
Chelsea are the team to worry about (As you said)

I was happy with the performance and the 57th goal of the season but anything less than a comfortable victory would have been a disaster.

[Killyoursons]

Utd produced football tonight the equal of anything you lot have since Arsene showed up so I dont want to hear any more from you about being the team of the purists. Shush. ;)

Banging your chest after beating Watford at home is truly pathetic. You've really let the 'Arsenal-play-the-beautiful-game' thing get to you.
This neutral would prefer to watch Arsenal, all things being equal. Obviously, United are more efficient, but I think Arsenal are more aesthetically pleasing, and no amount of goals at home to Watford is going to change that.
As for your jibes at Arsenal, they didn't play too badly last season against Juventus, most of whose team played in the World Cup final.
And for you, of all people, to question the objectivity of anyone on this forum is laughable.

[POL]

I love when he plays the old "I love them so much, I can't be objective, god love me, I'm such a great supporter, better than any of ye can understand " card :lol!:

[ho chi feen]

Oh the irony of that one.

Arsenal made their reputation beating no-mark opposition.

Sure, their invincibles foundered on the mighty rock that is Phil Neville.:rolleyes:

You mook, everyone knows that with their two league titles in the last 9 seasons, Arsenal are the greatest team in the world, EVER!.

It's been that way ever since 2004 when everyone agreed that Henry was better than Cruyff, and Arsenal were better than Brazil of 1970 and Real of 1960 combined and multiplied by a million.

You dolt.

[saltyfriedeggs]

You mook, everyone knows that with their two league titles in the last 9 seasons, Arsenal are the greatest team in the world, EVER!.

It's been that way ever since 2004 when everyone agreed that Henry was better than Cruyff, and Arsenal were better than Brazil of 1970 and Real of 1960 combined and multiplied by a million.

You dolt.

Three league titles.98' 02' 04'.Get your facts right ffs!

[toffeebhoy]

Both teams are capable of playing fast, exciting, attacking football.

Arsenal will hopefully be contenders again next season along with Manyoo, Chelsea and Liverpool if they can get more consistency and a settled forward line.

[RonnyB]

lLiverpool if they can get more consistency and a settled forward line.

you'll be hoping they dont.

[ho chi feen]

Three league titles.98' 02' 04'.Get your facts right ffs!

2007,
2006,
2005,
2004,
2003,
2002,
2001,
2000,
1999.

Was going to say 'since the turn of the century', but added in 1999 out of spite.

Oh, and when replying to posts pay special attention to the big, shiny, metal-hook in the middle, SFNE.



:p



Hell yeah, it's ON!

[homer jay]

Hell yeah, it's ON!

darn tootin'

[citdjsociety]

i'm a utd supporter and i can easily say that arsenal are the best team to watch in the league , but they are still along way behind you utd this year proving the point they blow hot and cold whearas utd and chelsea to a lesser extent have been reasonably consistant

[KolaKubes]

Utd produced football tonight the equal of anything you lot have since Arsene showed up so I dont want to hear any more from you about being the team of the purists. Shush. ;)

Let's return to my original post, shall we, before things get a little too, oh, I dunno, giddy?

The Larsson and Rooney goals last night were, regardless of the opposition, simply stunning. As was Rooney's deft chip against Portsmouth, as was Larsson's disallowed volley. And plenty more besides this year.

I challenge the gooners and their serfs to a Youtube duel. Let's see some examples of the same, edge of your seat such moments from the self-styled greatest team in the history of the world ever (TM).

I'll start you off, I thought this goal was class:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4MfA-W13Kg

Together with suitably French commentary.

[saltyfriedeggs]

2007,
2006,
2005,
2004,
2003,
2002,
2001,
2000,
1999.

Was going to say 'since the turn of the century', but added in 1999 out of spite.

Oh, and when replying to posts pay special attention to the big, shiny, metal-hook in the middle, SFNE.



:p



Hell yeah, it's ON!

You said the "last nine seasons".So your counting a season that hasnt finished (2007) as "the last"?And why would you start counting from the year after Arsenal won it in in 98'?Wouldnt it make more sense to say Arsenal have won 2 league titles in the last five years.

Thats like me saying Utd are shit because they havent won the league in a few years but I'll just forget what they won before that.

Manipulation of facts is never good.Or as sometimes we've seen in your case you just make them up.

[ho chi feen]

You said the "last nine seasons".So your counting a season that hasnt finished (2007) as "the last"?And why would you start counting from the year after Arsenal won it in in 98'?Wouldnt it make more sense to say Arsenal have won 2 league titles in the last five years.

Thats like me saying Utd are shit because they havent won the league in a few years but I'll just forget what they won before that.

Manipulation of facts is never good.Or as sometimes we've seen in your case you just make them up.

zooooooooOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOM!

Heh heh heh heh heh heh.


http://www.great-lakes.org/graphics/trion-front-reel.jpg

Too easy.

[KolaKubes]

zooooooooOOOOOOOOOOO OOOOM!

Heh heh heh heh heh heh.




Ridiculously easy in fact. ;)

[ho chi feen]

Banging your chest after beating Watford at home is truly pathetic. You've really let the 'Arsenal-play-the-beautiful-game' thing get to you.
This neutral would prefer to watch Arsenal, all things being equal. Obviously, United are more efficient, but I think Arsenal are more aesthetically pleasing, and no amount of goals at home to Watford is going to change that.
As for your jibes at Arsenal, they didn't play too badly last season against Juventus, most of whose team played in the World Cup final.
And for you, of all people, to question the objectivity of anyone on this forum is laughable.

Is it all that much more pathetic than people creaming themselves over 4-0's against the likes of an understrength Portsmouth in the FA Cup though?

[ho chi feen]

Ridiculously easy in fact. ;)

There's always one.

[RonnyB]

Is it all that much more pathetic than people creaming themselves over 4-0's against the likes of an understrength Portsmouth in the FA Cup though?

or a 10 man Charlton team 4-0 in the Prem?

[EL TORO]

I cannot believe this debate is still rolling. How about you just set up a poll for neutral fans and let them decide who provides the more fluid, pleasing to the eye, astute football, between the Reds and the Gooners. Its really that simple lads:wink:

[KolaKubes]

Is it all that much more pathetic than people creaming themselves over 4-0's against the likes of an understrength Portsmouth in the FA Cup though?

That was the zenith of Gooner giddiness. At the time, the Beeb website didn't bother with a team of the week, just selecting the Arsenal XI.

Wumming aside, what gets to me about them is that they disappear after an Arsenal turnaround but they're out en masse when things are going well.

I suppose what else would you expect from a shower that started following Arsenal when George Graham was in charge, the sort of side that could only appeal to a kid whose interest in football extended no further than watching for their results on teletext.

After another 10 years of Wenger, Arsenal fans will be as accustomed to quality football as us Utd fans are, then we might listen to you.

Maybe.

;)

[ho chi feen]

I cannot believe this debate is still rolling. How about you just set up a poll for neutral fans and let them decide who provides the more fluid, pleasing to the eye, astute football, between the Reds and the Gooners. Its really that simple lads:wink:

Come on FFS... most people would pick Luton town over Liverpool in the entertainment stakes, like.

[KolaKubes]

I cannot believe this debate is still rolling. How about you just set up a poll for neutral fans and let them decide who provides the more fluid, pleasing to the eye, astute football, between the Reds and the Gooners. Its really that simple lads:wink:

Oi, you, I explained, there's no such thing as "neutral" when it comes to Utd.

Not for proper fans at least.

Maybe you could put it on the Langers Forum, they'd be fairly objective.

[homer jay]

Come on FFS... most people would pick Luton town over Liverpool in the entertainment stakes, like.

hey



hey











totally uncalled for

[EL TORO]

Come on FFS... most people would pick Luton town over Liverpool in the entertainment stakes, like.

I was in fact refering to the Barnsley side that graced the prem for a season. Remember their fans singing ' Its just like watching Brazil!'

[KolaKubes]

Come on FFS... most people would pick Luton town over Liverpool in the entertainment stakes, like.

Leave them alone, I've actually enjoyed the odd Liverpool performance this year. Big improvement on the years of turgid cup football they've treated us to under their sophisticated foreign managers.

I still think they should bring back Roy Evans though.

[ho chi feen]

I was in fact refering to the Barnsley side that graced the prem for a season. Remember their fans singing ' Its just like watching Brazil!'

It's just like watching Brazil! (on drugs)
It's just like watching Brazil! (on drugs)
It's just like watching Braaaaaaaaaaa-zillllll! (on drugs)

[Edmund Blackwater]

I still think they should bring back Roy Evans though.
I don't agree.
Fowler seems to be benefitting from the exercise he's getting when picking up his own suits.

[homer jay]

Leave them alone, I've actually enjoyed the odd Liverpool performance this year. Big improvement on the years of turgid cup football they've treated us to under their sophisticated foreign managers.

I still think they should bring back Roy Evans though.

ahem

http://www.peoplesrepublico fcork.com/~peoplesr/forums/showpost.php?p=13749 25&postcount=37

[EL TORO]

Oi, you, I explained, there's no such thing as "neutral" when it comes to Utd.

Not for proper fans at least.

Maybe you could put it on the Langers Forum, they'd be fairly objective.

The reason i get to so many Utd games as an Evertonian is because They are one of my main clients and so i have nothing against them whatsoever. I probably have more dealings with them on a day to day basis than any Hardcore utd fan. I simply believe that Arsenal are more pleasing on the eye, its as simple as that fella.

[Sound]

Leave them alone, I've actually enjoyed the odd Liverpool performance this year. Big improvement on the years of turgid cup football they've treated us to under their sophisticated foreign managers.

I still think they should bring back Roy Evans though.


Now if you could meld Houllier's defence to Evans' attack...

[ho chi feen]

Now if you could meld Houllier's defence to Evans' attack...

... your Aunty Mary would put Johhny Holmes to shame?

[Killyoursons]

Let's return to my original post, shall we, before things get a little too, oh, I dunno, giddy?

The Larsson and Rooney goals last night were, regardless of the opposition, simply stunning. As was Rooney's deft chip against Portsmouth, as was Larsson's disallowed volley. And plenty more besides this year.

I challenge the gooners and their serfs to a Youtube duel. Let's see some examples of the same, edge of your seat such moments from the self-styled greatest team in the history of the world ever (TM).

I'll start you off, I thought this goal was class:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4MfA-W13Kg

Together with suitably French commentary.

I don't disagree with any of this. I'm thinking more of how the team as a whole play when they have the ball, rather than the excellence of the strikers. An example of what I have in mind is the football Arsenal played at home to CSKA Moscow (no great shakes, yes - but this is just an example). No goals, but some brilliant passing and movement. And - rather important, this - Arsenal have played similar football against serious teams.
Just to repeat, I'm not saying that Arsenal are a better team than United, just that their style of play is more attractive.
Ho Chi, people getting over-excited about the Gunners isn't the issue. The question is whether they play better football, not whether their fans and cheerleaders in the media are as bad or worse than United's.

[KolaKubes]

I don't disagree with any of this. I'm thinking more of how the team as a whole play when they have the ball, rather than the excellence of the strikers.


But hold up.

It's not just the Utd strikers that are easy on the eye. You could hardly call Carrick and Scholes clogger central midfielders. A bit one paced for my liking but they're both sweet passers of a football. Ronaldo and Giggs on the wings? Again, hardly from the Brett Emerson school of wing play. Evra at full back, Ferdinand at centre half? If anything, you could argue that they try and play it out too much from defence.

Wumming aside, I just think that to claim Arsenal play nicer football than Utd is a bit of a stretch. They have some notable differences in style which doesn't make direct comparison easy but I'll defer to Monsieur Wenger on this one "everyone thinks they have the prettiest wife at home". That works both ways.

I think Arsenal and the media have done a great disservice to Utd since they successfully painted a picture of Utd kicking them off the field to win games up to this season. Factually inaccurate if you look at the balance of play and the number of fouls in the games as happens.

If you know your history, for Arsenal of all clubs to lead such a campaign against a club with Utd's tradition of great football is extremely disrespectful.

Utd have done and continue to do far more for football in the UK and Ireland than Arsenal ever have or ever will.

Cheeky pups.

[Edmund Blackwater]

Utd have done and continue to do far more for football in the UK and Ireland than Arsenal ever have or ever will.

.

huh?

[POL]

Utd have done and continue to do far more for football in the UK and Ireland than Arsenal ever have or ever will.

Cheeky pups.

how dare you, ever hear of Celtic?????

[Sound]

But hold up.

It's not just the Utd strikers that are easy on the eye. You could hardly call Carrick and Scholes clogger central midfielders. A bit one paced for my liking but they're both sweet passers of a football. Ronaldo and Giggs on the wings? Again, hardly from the Brett Emerson school of wing play. Evra at full back, Ferdinand at centre half? If anything, you could argue that they try and play it out too much from defence.

Wumming aside, I just think that to claim Arsenal play nicer football than Utd is a bit of a stretch. They have some notable differences in style which doesn't make direct comparison easy but I'll defer to Monsieur Wenger on this one "everyone thinks they have the prettiest wife at home". That works both ways.

I think Arsenal and the media have done a great disservice to Utd since they successfully painted a picture of Utd kicking them off the field to win games up to this season. Factually inaccurate if you look at the balance of play and the number of fouls in the games as happens.

If you know your history, for Arsenal of all clubs to lead such a campaign against a club with Utd's tradition of great football is extremely disrespectful.

Utd have done and continue to do far more for football in the UK and Ireland than Arsenal ever have or ever will.

Cheeky pups.

I may have just seen it all.

Arsenal should be ashamed for letting themselves be outmuscled and not meeting fire with fire but trying to deny it happened is a downright lie.

[RonnyB]

I may have just seen it all.

Arsenal should be ashamed for letting themselves be outmuscled and not meeting fire with fire but trying to deny it happened is a downright lie.

How was it a kicking? The only foul that was of bad taste was RVN's. Arsenal set the trend themselves with Cole's early challenge on Ronaldo going unpunished (not to mention taking the legs from under him in the penalty area later on). As for the Neville's 'maiming' Reyes, they each got a booking for their challenges. Hardly worthy of the 'kicking' that was portrayed.

[ho chi feen]

I may have just seen it all.

Arsenal should be ashamed for letting themselves be outmuscled and not meeting fire with fire but trying to deny it happened is a downright lie.

True, think of all the great games where they've decided to come out, attack us, and play football. October 2003, Old Trafford; January 2006, Highbury; April 2006, Old Trafford; September 2006, Old Trafford; Err... 2005, Cardiff.

Yeah.

It's ON.

[ho chi feen]

How was it a kicking? The only foul that was of bad taste was RVN's. Arsenal set the trend themselves with Cole's early challenge on Ronaldo going unpunished (not to mention taking the legs from under him in the penalty area later on). As for the Neville's 'maiming' Reyes, they each got a booking for their challenges. Hardly worthy of the 'kicking' that was portrayed.

Yeah, remember the time we allegedly kicked Reyes off the pitch, yet he was fine the next week. And the only player injured was Scholes?

Of course, big gay Sol and Ashley Cole would never do anything nasty and malicious on the field of play. They're real footballers you see, not cloggers like you see at Old Trafford week in, week out.

[Sound]

How was it a kicking? The only foul that was of bad taste was RVN's. Arsenal set the trend themselves with Cole's early challenge on Ronaldo going unpunished (not to mention taking the legs from under him in the penalty area later on). As for the Neville's 'maiming' Reyes, they each got a booking for their challenges. Hardly worthy of the 'kicking' that was portrayed.

Oh give over.

Anyone who has ever played a game of half competitive football knows what happened in that game. Reyes is a fanny and he doesn't like the rough stuff. Fergie astutely spotted this and he was given a bit of treatment. Big swing- he should be enough of a man to take it. He wasn't and it worked to Utd's benefit. And hiding behind what the ref did is disingenuous and, frankly, fucking stupid.

[homer jay]

I may have just seen it all.

Arsenal should be ashamed for letting themselves be outmuscled and not meeting fire with fire but trying to deny it happened is a downright lie.

don't even bother biy.

[Sound]

True, think of all the great games where they've decided to come out, attack us, and play football. October 2003, Old Trafford; January 2006, Highbury; April 2006, Old Trafford; September 2006, Old Trafford; Err... 2005, Cardiff.

Yeah.

It's ON.

Come off the stage Ho Chi. I'm talking about them getting a kicking not attacking Utd. I'd have expected you of all people to not simply toe the party line.

[RonnyB]

Oh give over.

Anyone who has ever played a game of half competitive football knows what happened in that game. Reyes is a fanny and he doesn't like the rough stuff. Fergie astutely spotted this and he was given a bit of treatment. Big swing- he should be enough of a man to take it. He wasn't and it worked to Utd's benefit. And hiding behind what the ref did is disingenuous and, frankly, fucking stupid.

Was it any different to Cole's challenges on Ronaldo? I mean Ronaldo is percived as the biggest girl in the Prem yet it didnt effect his game.

[ho chi feen]

Come off the stage Ho Chi. I'm talking about them getting a kicking not attacking Utd. I'd have expected you of all people to not simply toe the party line.

There's no party line, as far as I'm concerned. I'll decide for myself.

It's not United's fault if Arsenal had a lot of fannies in their side at one time.

I can remember some great games that were hard yet fair, the only instances of thuggishness I can recall being Van Nistelrooy in 2004, Ashley Cole in the Charity Shield in 2003, and Sol Campbell in April 2003, all of which were rightly punished.

It's no as black-and-white as those who claim Arsenal are the greatest footballing side on the plane/United are a bunch of thugs like to paint it. Simplications and received wisdom are comforting for some, but the realities give a different picture.

[RonnyB]

It's not United's fault if Arsenal had a lot of fannies in their side at one time.

I can remember some great games that were hard yet fair, the only instances of thuggishness I can recall being Van Nistelrooy in 2004, Ashley Cole in the Charity Shield in 2003, and Sol Campbell in April 2003, all of which were rightly punished.

add Franny Jeffers' stamp on Phil Neville to that

and Mikael Silvestre head butting Ljungberg this day two years ago.

[Sound]

Was it any different to Cole's challenges on Ronaldo? I mean Ronaldo is percived as the biggest girl in the Prem yet it didnt effect his game.

No he isn't. He's perceived as a diver, I've never seen him put off by hefty tackling. Reyes is.

I'm not demonising Utd, they're fit pros and should be able to take it. Just dont try to lie that it didn't happen.

[RonnyB]

No he isn't. He's perceived as a diver, I've never seen him put off by hefty tackling. Reyes is.

I'm not demonising Utd, they're fit pros and should be able to take it. Just dont try to lie that it didn't happen.

I'm not denying it didnt happen. What I do mind is the perception that United only beat them by foul means and the way Arsenal played the victim card.

[Sound]

There's no party line, as far as I'm concerned. I'll decide for myself.

It's not United's fault if Arsenal had a lot of fannies in their side at one time.

I can remember some great games that were hard yet fair, the only instances of thuggishness I can recall being Van Nistelrooy in 2004, Ashley Cole in the Charity Shield in 2003, and Sol Campbell in April 2003, all of which were rightly punished.

It's no as black-and-white as those who claim Arsenal are the greatest footballing side on the plane/United are a bunch of thugs like to paint it. Simplications and received wisdom are comforting for some, but the realities give a different picture.

Indeed it isn't and the Arse's soft underbelly is fair game in my book. I just object to people turning a blind eye to the fact that Utd targeted Reyes.

Just looking for some perspective and people to take off the specs.

[KolaKubes]

huh?

Moulding Keane and Irwin into worldclass players was worth its weight in gold for Ireland.

how dare you, ever hear of Celtic?????

Celtic have done more for football in these islands than Utd? You're talking shite now.

I may have just seen it all.

Arsenal should be ashamed for letting themselves be outmuscled and not meeting fire with fire but trying to deny it happened is a downright lie.

Sound, you are a case in point. A reasonable individual who looks back on that game and thinks of Gary Neville et al kicking poor Reyes off the field, Rooney diving around like Swan Lake etc.

Fact is, Reyes was fouled less than Ronaldo in that game. Indeed, everyone seems to have forgotten Ashley Cole's disgraceful lunge on him as he got his first touch. The overall foul tally was almost identical. I'm sorry, after an extensive net trawl, I couldn't find the stats again but I remember this point clearly being made with a source off soccernet.

Rooney's penalty was never as clear cut a dive as made out in some quarters and Ronaldo was denied a stonewall penalty later in the game.

And yet, the "neutral" looks back on the game as one of Utd kicking Arsenal off the field.

We never hear about Utd hammering Arsenal at Highbury 4-2 since then or about one of the most ridiculously unfair results of recent times when Arsenal lifted the FA Cup in 2005 scarcely having troubled the Utd keeper.

This year was the first time that Arsenal managed to beat Utd in 11 or 12 attempts and over that period, apparently, Utd could never match them for football, just relentless fouling.

It's a myth of Munster proportions.

[ho chi feen]

add Franny Jeffers' stamp on Phil Neville to that

and Mikael Silvestre head butting Ljungberg this day two years ago.

I can't quite recall the former, and I'd completely forgotten about the latter.

Not so black and white when you come to think of it really, is it?

That 4-2 game two season ago has to go down as one of the greatest the Premiership has ever seen. Two excellent sides going for it blood and thunder with some wonderful football and no shortage of goals or drama. Might even rank it above the first Pool/Newcastle 4-3.

[POL]

Just looking for some perspective and people to take off the specs.its ronnie kubes you are dealing with here

[POL]

Celtic have done more for football in these islands than Utd? You're talking shite now.



.

Jesus Christ you haven't a fucking clue about anything do you? Walfrid would be spining in his grave if he saw this statement

[Sound]

Moulding Keane and Irwin into worldclass players was worth its weight in gold for Ireland.



Celtic have done more for football in these islands than Utd? You're talking shite now.



Sound, you are a case in point. A reasonable individual who looks back on that game and thinks of Gary Neville et al kicking poor Reyes off the field, Rooney diving around like Swan Lake etc.

Fact is, Reyes was fouled less than Ronaldo in that game. Indeed, everyone seems to have forgotten Ashley Cole's disgraceful lunge on him as he got his first touch. The overall foul tally was almost identical. I'm sorry, after an extensive net trawl, I couldn't find the stats again but I remember this point clearly being made with a source off soccernet.

Rooney's penalty was never as clear cut a dive as made out in some quarters and Ronaldo was denied a stonewall penalty later in the game.

And yet, the "neutral" looks back on the game as one of Utd kicking Arsenal off the field.

We never hear about Utd hammering Arsenal at Highbury 4-2 since then or about one of the most ridiculously unfair results of recent times when Arsenal lifted the FA Cup in 2005 scarcely having troubled the Utd keeper.

This year was the first time that Arsenal managed to beat Utd in 11 or 12 attempts and over that period, apparently, Utd could never match them for football, just relentless fouling.

It's a myth of Munster proportions.

Yes or no answer.

Was Reyes targeted in that game?

[KolaKubes]

I just object to people turning a blind eye to the fact that Utd targeted Reyes.

Targeted for what though?

The two Neville's put in some hard tackles on him. I'd have told them to do exactly the same. One of them was mildly OTT, the other seemed a fair challenge to me, if memory serves (and I've not got Ho Chi's mind for such details admittedly). I do remember being aghast at the Ashley Cole tackle on Ronaldo which I thought was certainly a yellow card. I don't think Riley even gave a foul but, then, Ronaldo was a "diver" you see.

Like other Arsenal myths, the "kicked off the park at OT in 2004" one is a steaming crock of shit.

Do you hear Utd players, officials and media pundits harping on about the behaviour of Arsenal after RVN's penalty miss at the start of that unbeaten run? Or the pizza throwing which Arsenal still seem to find hilarious when it was simply crass?

That shower have been slinging mud at Utd with years and clearly a lot of it has stuck.

[RonnyB]

Yes or no answer.

Was Reyes targeted in that game?

he was targeted the same way Arsenal targeted Ronaldo.

[Sound]

Targeted for what though?

The two Neville's put in some hard tackles on him. I'd have told them to do exactly the same. One of them was mildly OTT, the other seemed a fair challenge to me, if memory serves (and I've not got Ho Chi's mind for such details admittedly). I do remember being aghast at the Ashley Cole tackle on Ronaldo which I thought was certainly a yellow card. I don't think Riley even gave a foul but, then, Ronaldo was a "diver" you see.

Like other Arsenal myths, the "kicked off the park at OT in 2004" one is a steaming crock of shit.

Do you hear Utd players, officials and media pundits harping on about the behaviour of Arsenal after RVN's penalty miss at the start of that unbeaten run? Or the pizza throwing which Arsenal still seem to find hilarious when it was simply crass?

That shower have been slinging mud at Utd with years and clearly a lot of it has stuck.

Targeted for some rough treatment.

Yes or no?

[Edmund Blackwater]

Moulding Keane and Irwin into worldclass players was worth its weight in gold for Ireland..

Both Keane and Irwin were accomplished footballers when they joined manyoo.

Arsenal moulded Brady and Stapleton and, I suppose big Niall.
Them boys never amounted to much though.

[KolaKubes]

Jesus Christ you haven't a fucking clue about anything do you? Walfrid would be spining in his grave if he saw this statement

You're quite quaint in your own way.

Celtic=Scottish club numbnuts.

I can't quite recall the former, and I'd completely forgotten about the latter.

Not so black and white when you come to think of it really, is it?



Which is precisely what I'm getting at.

Print a version of events enough times and it becomes established fact in the minds of even neutral observers.

Some of the London media are no better than the "Madrid paper" and the "Barcelona paper" in Spain.

[Sound]

he was targeted the same way Arsenal targeted Ronaldo.

Ronaldo shipped one very heavy and disgraceful tackle. Reyes shipped far more.

[Sound]

You're quite quaint in your own way.

Celtic=Scottish club numbnuts.



Which is precisely what I'm getting at.

Print a version of events enough times and it becomes established fact in the minds of even neutral observers.

Some of the London media are no better than the "Madrid paper" and the "Barcelona paper" in Spain.

WHOOSH!

[KolaKubes]

Targeted for some rough treatment.

Yes or no?

I thought I answered you in the above.

If by rough treatment you mean "rattle him early with a few tough tackles", absolutely he was.

Nothing wrong with that in my book, I'd be a hypocrite to claim otherwise having taken on that responsibility myself in a few games over the years.

Although, again, I'd never go out to injure a player.

I have been known to take ball and man but, then, that's ended up with me injured myself as often as not! :D Just desserts I guess.

[RonnyB]

Both Keane and Irwin were accomplished footballers when they joined manyoo.


Ah yes what was it Keane said again. I rememeber now, something along the lines of,

"When I look back now on some of the old games on MUTV i cant believe how poor I was in games I thought I done OK in at the time. Maybe the manager instructed Robbo to have a chat with me. Knowing how the manager works it wouldnt surprise me."

As for Irwin, he had barely played for Ireland when United signed him. He wasnt even good enough to get into the Italia '90 World Cup squad.

[Forsberg]

Yes or no answer.

Was Reyes targeted in that game?

Sound, I brought this up in the Cheats Corners thread and you agreed with KK and dismissed it as pretty fair

http://www.peoplesrepublico fcork.com/~peoplesr/forums/showpost.php?p=11900 25&postcount=13

Why the change?

[RonnyB]

Ronaldo shipped one very heavy and disgraceful tackle. Reyes shipped far more.

what about the stone wall pen in the 2nd?

[KolaKubes]

Ronaldo shipped one very heavy and disgraceful tackle. Reyes shipped far more.

You're not listening to me, Ronaldo was fouled more than Reyes in that game and the only heavy fouls Reyes took were those two by the Nevilles, only one of which was actually a foul, neither of which was as bad as the one Cole dished out.

WHOOSH!

I don't know what you're getting at. Some arcane aspect of the Celtic misty links with the Emerald Isle. All of which I pretty much despise. My take on Scottish football is I'll support anyone playing the Old Firm clubs.

[KolaKubes]

Ah yes what was it Keane said again. I rememeber now, something along the lines of,

"When I look back now on some of the old games on MUTV i cant believe how poor I was in games I thought I done OK in at the time. Maybe the manager instructed Robbo to have a chat with me. Knowing how the manager works it wouldnt surprise me."

As for Irwin, he had barely played for Ireland when United signed him. He wasnt even good enough to get into the Italia '90 World Cup squad.

A better question would be what exactly Celtic have done for Ireland in recent generations to merit the support they get from here?

The last star Irish player to play up there made his name as captain of Utd.

[KolaKubes]

Sound, I brought this up in the Cheats Corners thread and you agreed with KK and dismissed it as pretty fair

http://www.peoplesrepublico fcork.com/~peoplesr/forums/showpost.php?p=11900 25&postcount=13 (http://www.peoplesrepublico fcork.com/%7Epeoplesr/forums/showpost.php?p=11900 25&postcount=13)

Why the change?

My my.

[Sound]

Sound, I brought this up in the Cheats Corners thread and you agreed with KK and dismissed it as pretty fair

http://www.peoplesrepublico fcork.com/~peoplesr/forums/showpost.php?p=11900 25&postcount=13

Why the change?

No change at all Forsberg. As I said he's a fanny and should be able to take it but we had people denying it ever happened on here which is a blatant lie and deserves challenging.

[Edmund Blackwater]

Ah yes what was it Keane said again. I rememeber now, something along the lines of,

"When I look back now on some of the old games on MUTV i cant believe how poor I was in games I thought I done OK in at the time. Maybe the manager instructed Robbo to have a chat with me. Knowing how the manager works it wouldnt surprise me."

As for Irwin, he had barely played for Ireland when United signed him. He wasnt even good enough to get into the Italia '90 World Cup squad.

If you had quoted me something from Irwin's book, a man who never shirked a challenge, then I would have said 'grand', but to make your point, quoting Keane, a reknowned bottler and big man for the small occasion, is hust laughable.

[KolaKubes]

No change at all Forsberg. As I said he's a fanny and should be able to take it but we had people denying it ever happened on here which is a blatant lie and deserves challenging.

Come off it. You said yourself what he got was mainly hard but fair. I've said no different.

[Forsberg]

No change at all Forsberg. As I said he's a fanny and should be able to take it but we had people denying it ever happened on here which is a blatant lie and deserves challenging.

Fair nuff . But in fairness to KK he's pretty much making the same points now as he was back then

[KolaKubes]

Fair nuff . But in fairness to KK he's pretty much making the same points now as he was back then

Because my points are red-tinted but reasoned and based on what actually happened in a game.

Same as any point I make on here.

I have no problem with people challenging my objectivity (guilty as charged) but I'd hope for equally reasoned and challenging responses (even if similarly lacking objectivity).

The only thing that gets my goat on here is when people mistake singing from the same hymn sheet as several others as being a sign they're right when, in this media saturated age, might merely mean they've all been exposed to the carefully crafted spin of some well-placed journalist.

We should conduct a little experiment there for after the next big game on the agenda. Everyone pick a thread and give your interpretation of the game without reading a single post on here or listening to half-time or full-time punditry.

I'll bet there'll be an awful lot more variation in opinion than normal.

I'm serious about the experiment actually. We'll arrange a set of questions beforehand (MOTM, key moments, ref's performance, etc.). Guaranteed the results will be all over the place.

[Sound]

Fair nuff . But in fairness to KK he's pretty much making the same points now as he was back then

I was railling aginast this gem:

'I think Arsenal and the media have done a great disservice to Utd since they successfully painted a picture of Utd kicking them off the field to win games up to this season. Factually inaccurate if you look at the balance of play and the number of fouls in the games as happens.'

I think that this is rich when it's clear that Reyes was targetted. If I were Fergie I'd have done exactly the same but bleating about the media conspiracy in the face of the facts is akin to the aspersions of victimhood that Utd fans are fond of directing down the East Lancs road.

[homer jay]

he was targeted the same way Arsenal targeted Ronaldo.

so it's alright for utd to do it, because arsenal were doing it to c ronaldo?

:roll: and round and round we go ffs

[KolaKubes]

I think that this is rich when it's clear that Reyes was targetted. If I were Fergie I'd have done exactly the same but bleating about the media conspiracy in the face of the facts is akin to the aspersions of victimhood that Utd fans are fond of directing down the East Lancs road.

Targetted for tight marking, few hard tackles, what's wrong with that?

As for your other dig, you're victimising me further by claiming I'm trying to play the victim. Very upsetting. I'm going to light a candle.

I would do a minute's silence but, God knows, I find that tricky.

[Sound]

Targetted for tight marking, few hard tackles, what's wrong with that?

As for your other dig, you're victimising me further by claiming I'm trying to play the victim. Very upsetting. I'm going to light a candle.

I would do a minute's silence but, God knows, I find that tricky.

So if it happened then how is it a media conspiracy?

As for the rest of it- I wouldn't stoop.

[Killyoursons]

But hold up.

It's not just the Utd strikers that are easy on the eye. You could hardly call Carrick and Scholes clogger central midfielders. A bit one paced for my liking but they're both sweet passers of a football. Ronaldo and Giggs on the wings? Again, hardly from the Brett Emerson school of wing play. Evra at full back, Ferdinand at centre half? If anything, you could argue that they try and play it out too much from defence.

Wumming aside, I just think that to claim Arsenal play nicer football than Utd is a bit of a stretch. They have some notable differences in style which doesn't make direct comparison easy but I'll defer to Monsieur Wenger on this one "everyone thinks they have the prettiest wife at home". That works both ways.

I think Arsenal and the media have done a great disservice to Utd since they successfully painted a picture of Utd kicking them off the field to win games up to this season. Factually inaccurate if you look at the balance of play and the number of fouls in the games as happens.

If you know your history, for Arsenal of all clubs to lead such a campaign against a club with Utd's tradition of great football is extremely disrespectful.

Utd have done and continue to do far more for football in the UK and Ireland than Arsenal ever have or ever will.

Cheeky pups.

Maybe it does, but I'm not an Arsenal fan. Unlike you, I'm not biased by club allegiance (I have none).
Bringing history in to it and banging on about media campaigns is missing the point. The issue isn't 'who has the more annoying media cheerleaders?' It's 'who plays the more attractive football?' United are an attractive team to watch, Arsenal, imo, and that of most neutrals I know, are more so.
Re the list of players you gave at the start: I'm not talking about individual skills, it's more the overall style of the team I'm interested in. Chelsea have a lot of very skilful and attractive players as well - the two Coles, Robben, Ballack, even Lampard when he's on form - but their style of play doesn't appeal to me. The same squad coached by Wenger (or Ferguson) would play in a very different manner.

[KolaKubes]

So if it happened then how is it a media conspiracy?

As for the rest of it- I wouldn't stoop.

Sigh, Sound, do you not get the difference between targetted for some hard tackles and targetted for a bit of a kicking?

One is foul play, one is not.

It's also less a media conspiracy than the sort of group think that the British (and increasingly the Irish) media are guilty of more often than not.

The most ludicrous recent example of this was when Cristiano Ronaldo became the bete noir of English football after some eejit decided that it was he rather than Rooney's stupid challenge and the usual fallibility of their national team that they got knocked out of the World Cup.

That little episode could have seen, arguably, our player of the season if not the Premiership's player of the season forced out of English football and this little title charge would never have happened.

You don't see how this kind of thing would piss off Utd fans?

Mike Reilly didn't give two clear goals for Utd at OT last weekend. Do you think maybe the vitriol he was exposed to for giving that penalty to Rooney (even though noone has been able to point to any other of the penalties he awarded at OT prior to that as being dodgy, merely a quirk of fate) had anything to do with that?

I've shifted the goalposts here now a bit but it's all part of the same dull ABU sensibilities that prevail.

[ho chi feen]

Ronaldo shipped one very heavy and disgraceful tackle. Reyes shipped far more.

How many? We have two so far, one a foul, the other fair.

To be honest I'm struggling to think of others, such is the maner in which im impressed (or, indeed, failed to) upon on me at the time, as opposed to what was written afterwards.

I'm open to correction on any of this. I just can't recall anything that seemed particularly noteworthy during the game, except one bad tackle- and only then, vaguely.

[Edmund Blackwater]

How many? We have two so far, one a foul, the other fair.

To be honest I'm struggling to think of others, such is the maner in which im impressed (or, indeed, failed to) upon on me at the time, as opposed to what was written afterwards.

I'm open to correction on any of this. I just can't recall anything that seemed particularly noteworthy during the game, except one bad tackle- and only then, vaguely.

My memory of the match is that 3 manyoo players should have been sent off for fouling Reyes - Tash Neville; Useless Neville and Can't tackle Scholes.
The tash should have went twice, but got nothing but a free kck given against him the first time and got a yellow the second.
Useless Neville should have had two yellows as should Scholes (perhaps harsh considering he just can't tackle).
I'd be surprised to learn that any less than 8 seperate manyoo players fouled Reyes that day.
It wasn't hard and fair as Kelvin maintains, it was an orchestrated campaign to kick Reyes out if the game and it was successful in more ways than one.

[STEVIEG]

Christ get over it people pussy Reyes couldn't hack it and had to eventually leave the Prem he got so rattled

Arsenal are better off without him anyway

I see no mention of the match, earlier in their unbeaten campaign, where they blatantly cheated to get a result against Portsmouth (Robert Pires dive)

It was good for the league that United knocked the so-called Invincibles off their perch
I wouldn't mind but the furore about all of this, and another much publicised incident (The Mendes goal for Spurs which should have stood), is totally out of proportion considering that The Red Devils didn't even win the league in those seasons

Why don't you save the bitterness for the years in which they did win and drag up some crap about injury time in 1993 while you are at it....

I'm sure Fuckwater still crys at night thinking about that one

[Langer Dan]

Christ get over it people pussy Reyes couldn't hack it and had to eventually leave the Prem he got so rattled

Arsenal are better off without him anyway

I see no mention of the match, earlier in their unbeaten campaign, where they blatantly cheated to get a result against Portsmouth (Robert Pires dive)

It was good for the league that United knocked the so-called Invincibles off their perch
I wouldn't mind but the furore about all of this, and another much publicised incident (The Mendes goal for Spurs which should have stood), is totally out of proportion considering that The Red Devils didn't even win the league in those seasons

Why don't you save the bitterness for the years in which they did win and drag up some crap about injury time in 1993 while you are at it....

I'm sure Fuckwater still crys at night thinking about that one

heh heh heh,

nice

[Edmund Blackwater]

Christ get over it people pussy Reyes couldn't hack it and had to eventually leave the Prem he got so rattled

Arsenal are better off without him anyway

I see no mention of the match, earlier in their unbeaten campaign, where they blatantly cheated to get a result against Portsmouth (Robert Pires dive)

It was good for the league that United knocked the so-called Invincibles off their perch
I wouldn't mind but the furore about all of this, and another much publicised incident (The Mendes goal for Spurs which should have stood), is totally out of proportion considering that The Red Devils didn't even win the league in those seasons

Why don't you save the bitterness for the years in which they did win and drag up some crap about injury time in 1993 while you are at it....

I'm sure Fuckwater still crys at night thinking about that one

You appear to be skipping over any of the issues being discussed in the thread.............. ....for a change.
Reyes was targeted
Wrongaldo was targeted
Manyoo or Arsenal play better football.

Everything else is superfluous to this thread.

[STEVIEG]

You appear to be skipping over any of the issues being discussed in the thread.............. ....for a change.


My first entry in this thread sums it up

Quote
"Kola I agree with some of your points (Carrick etc) but this could have been included in the midweek footy thread

Creating a thread after United beat a poor Watford is obviously gonna be understandably annoying for some, Spurs and Liverpool will be a much bigger tests
I don't see why you have to reference Arsenal all the time, who cares? They are 15 points back and out of contention (though looking good for a cup or two)
Chelsea are the team to worry about (As you said)

I was happy with the performance and the 57th goal of the season but anything less than a comfortable victory would have been a disaster."

Unquote

as for any other issues
I've been posting here for nearly 7 years and any relevant issues would have been dealt with at length at the time by me and the other posters here,not Johhny-come-lately bitter bandwagonist wums like yourself......

[ho chi feen]

It wasn't hard and fair as Kelvin maintains, it was an orchestrated campaign to kick Reyes out if the game and it was successful in more ways than one.

You don't need to kick Reyes to put him out of the game, the fact that he's a complete pile of piss takes care of that. :)

As for the rest of what you posted, games that ocurred in your imagination don't count.

[Edmund Blackwater]

not Johhny-come-lately bitter bandwagonist wums like yourself......

If i was a manyooer would my points be taken on their merits?

[STEVIEG]

If i was a manyooer would my points be taken on their merits?


There's people here who support United that I've had loads of disagreements and arguments with, but at least they have the balls to name their team and are not motivated by bitterness and jealousy.........

Arsenal this week, Liverpool next week, Chelsea the week after, now that's what I call bandwagonism.....

[KolaKubes]

I'd be surprised to learn that any less than 8 seperate manyoo players fouled Reyes that day.

Be surprised so. I can't find the link, probably dead at this stage three years on, but the stats were floating around online until last year certainly and I remember the foul tally was very very similar.

I also suspect you're mistaking this supposed Scholes foul with one that happened in a different game. The semi-final of the FA Cup the previous year in fact. Now, that was a bad foul.

[xvis]

...I much prefer watching Spurs to Arsenal.

I find them to be a team of more overall redeeming character than their gooner brethern. You have to factor in the overall character of the team which forms their style of play, and Arsenal possess some negative aspects instilled by their manager.


In short, .....I'd draw the curtains.



edit:
and I'd agree with El Toro regarding United in the first half last night, ..the attacking incisiveness was non-existant. ...very haphazard stuff. Carrick was indeed superb as well btw.

[Forsberg]

...I much prefer watching Spurs to Arsenal.

I find them to be a team of more overall redeeming character than their gooner brethern. You have to factor in the overall character of the team which forms their style of play, and Arsenal possess some negative aspects instilled by their manager.


In short, .....I'd draw the curtains.


Ya. they were fantastic last night. Made the little gooners look very ordinary

[xvis]

Ya. they were fantastic last night. Made the little gooners look very ordinary

It's not all about the result as people have been saying, ...some of Lennon and Berbatovs play in recent weeks has been superb.

...and Jol is a top bloke.

[Forsberg]

It's not all about the result as people have been saying, ...some of Lennon and Berbatovs play in recent weeks has been superb.

...and Jol is a top bloke.

Well Berbatov's form has been very patchy this season . He only seems to turn up for home games. As for Lennon , he's played well but I don't get the huge hype about him. For me he's no better than SWP or Downing, .

I like Jol though. A few tactical errors lately but overall he seems to have lifted spurs to a higher and has brought in some good youngsters

[xvis]

I like Jol though. A few tactical errors lately but overall he seems to have lifted spurs to a higher and has brought in some good youngsters

and he loves cups! ....which is a dying art.
....some mid table manager at the weekend was more worried about a 17 remaining 'cup games' than their weekend cup exit. ..pathetic.

[KolaKubes]

...I much prefer watching Spurs to Arsenal.

I find them to be a team of more overall redeeming character than their gooner brethern. You have to factor in the overall character of the team which forms their style of play, and Arsenal possess some negative aspects instilled by their manager.

I agree with that 100%. Arsenal have just shifted from cynical and ugly to cynical and pretty. Spurs are more traditional exponents of the beautiful game.

[xvis]

I agree with that 100%. Arsenal have just shifted from cynical and ugly to cynical and pretty. Spurs are more traditional exponents of the beautiful game.

Indeed. ...even Chelsea have shown some good grace when losing or drawing to opponents recently, something this Arsenal team would never do, ..just not in their character.

[KolaKubes]

Indeed. ...even Chelsea have shown some good grace when losing or drawing to opponents recently, something this Arsenal team would never do, ..just not in their character.

I've always presumed it's some sort of retarded "siege mentality" thing. Utd could be graceless in defeat at times (think Schmeichel, G Nev) but this crowd take the biscuit.

Chelsea are worse mind you, they've just had manners put on them in recent weeks.

[Sharkey]

Chelsea are worse mind you, they've just had manners put on them in recent weeks.

thats cos they're getting a more acquired taste for losing/drawing lately.

I'm a liverpool supporter but have to admit that arsenal for me are the best team to watch. even when they can't break down a team they usually tend to stick to their game plan without reverting to desperate tactics like most clubs.
of the top 4 heres how i would rate them over the previous few years

United: Quality:sometimes brilliant........... ...Effectiveness:hig h
Chelsea: Quality: mostly boring.............. ..Effectiveness:high
Liverpool; Quality: rarely.............. .........Effectivene ss:low
Arsenal: Quality: usually high................ ....Effectiveness:so metimes high

[KolaKubes]

thats cos they're getting a more acquired taste for losing/drawing lately.

I'm a liverpool supporter but have to admit that arsenal for me are the best team to watch. even when they can't break down a team they usually tend to stick to their game plan without reverting to desperate tactics like most clubs.
of the top 4 heres how i would rate them over the previous few years

United: Quality:sometimes brilliant........... ...Effectiveness:hig h
Chelsea: Quality: mostly boring.............. ..Effectiveness:high
Liverpool; Quality: rarely.............. .........Effectivene ss:low
Arsenal: Quality: usually high................ ....Effectiveness:so metimes high

I'd have to agree with that.

[st finnbar]

thats cos they're getting a more acquired taste for losing/drawing lately.

I'm a liverpool supporter but have to admit that arsenal for me are the best team to watch. even when they can't break down a team they usually tend to stick to their game plan without reverting to desperate tactics like most clubs.
of the top 4 heres how i would rate them over the previous few years

United: Quality:sometimes brilliant........... ...Effectiveness:hig h
Chelsea: Quality: mostly boring.............. ..Effectiveness:high
Liverpool; Quality: rarely.............. .........Effectivene ss:low
Arsenal: Quality: usually high................ ....Effectiveness:so metimes high

liverpool have gone further with rafa, not much mind, but not as boring

chelsea, a much as i hate them, 2 leagues in a row is not to be sniffed at

arsenal, great when allowed to play , but hey it s a 38 game season, and you wont be allowed play your own way every game

man u, great going forward, and evra and vidc have really improved, and ronaldo has been great this season, lets roll on 9 prem:D

[POL]

You're quite quaint in your own way.

Celtic=Scottish club numbnuts.



.You really disgust me KolaB, Celtic have done more for Irish sport and republicanism than Manchester United ever could, their contribution to Irish Culture and the struggle for freedom can never be overestimated, Sales of An Phoblachtat at Celtic games funded the struggle during the dark periods, what did ManYoo ever do for Irish Independence, for Catholicism? Celtic are an Irish Club for an Irish people, don't ever forget that you traitor to Irish freedom, oh yes siree, Tom Barry had the right idea for craven sleevens like yourself, an early morning appointment with at the end of a Barrell

[Edmund Blackwater]

Kola knows nothing about Irish Republicanism or Celtic's struggles to embiggen the Irish nation.

[POL]

Kola knows nothing about Irish Republicanism or Celtic's struggles to embiggen the Irish nation.

he'll be educated yet, by god he will

[Pez123]

You really disgust me KolaB, Celtic have done more for Irish sport and republicanism than Manchester United ever could, their contribution to Irish Culture and the struggle for freedom can never be overestimated, Sales of An Phoblachtat at Celtic games funded the struggle during the dark periods, what did ManYoo ever do for Irish Independence, for Catholicism? Celtic are an Irish Club for an Irish people, don't ever forget that you traitor to Irish freedom, oh yes siree, Tom Barry had the right idea for craven sleevens like yourself, an early morning appointment with at the end of a Barrell

Politics should never ever have anything to do with sport, you are a disgrace...

Sectarianism is a stain on footballs underpants...

[POL]

What have ManYoo done for Ireland?

[Edmund Blackwater]

What have ManYoo done for Ireland?
According to the Manyoo compendium,
They brought Dev back fom Ameica, shot Michael Collins, Fed people duing the famine, bokered a ceasefie in norn ion and through their puchase of the chinese lad ensued a global peace fo the next 20 yeas, which can only be a good thing for Irish tade.

[STEVIEG]

Slow day today boys.............

[POL]

Seriously Edmund, Kola needs to answer this, what the fuck have ManYoo ever done for this country except exploit clueless bandwagon hoping jersey collectors

[Edmund Blackwater]

Seriously Edmund, Kola needs to answer this, what the fuck have ManYoo ever done for this country except exploit clueless bandwagon hoping jersey collectors
there's no point.
It'll be the usual roy Keane and Denis Irwin shite as though manyoo made them and suckled them at thei breasts from childbirth.
What have manyoo done for Ireland?
Recently?
John O'Shea.
Thanks manyoo, you're the bestest.

[Forsberg]

there's no point.
It'll be the usual roy Keane and Denis Irwin shite as though manyoo made them and suckled them at thei breasts from childbirth.
What have manyoo done for Ireland?
Recently?
John O'Shea.
Thanks manyoo, you're the bestest.

Ed . where's your Maccarone/McClaren thread gone?

[POL]

Ireland would never have had a team that won the European Cup only for Celtic

[Edmund Blackwater]

Ed . where's your Maccarone/McClaren thread gone?
I think the mods like Mclaren.

[STEVIEG]

Ed . where's your Maccarone/McClaren thread gone?

It's a pity he didn't delete all his pointless threads when he realised how crap they were.......

PS-This forum is never moderated

[Edmund Blackwater]

It's a pity he didn't delete all his pointless threads when he realised how crap they were.......

PS-This forum is never moderated
If all pointless posts were being deleted, stevie I'd tell you to shut up, noob.

[STEVIEG]

Bad back-tracking yet again we are watching

[RonnyB]

so it's alright for utd to do it, because arsenal were doing it to c ronaldo?

:roll: and round and round we go ffs

The only difference between Arsenal's behaviour to Ronaldo & United's to Reyes was that Ronaldo took them on regardless and didnt act the faggot.

The only complaints Arsenal fans can have from that day was horseface's stamp on Cole & Rio's collision with Freddie (which I dont think freddie was through on goal anyway seeing as Carroll was at the edge of his area to collect). RVN suffered for his foul with a 3 game ban.

Arsenal playing the victims of a kicking was blown out of all proportion. In Feb '03 they didnt complain too much when United's tackles were a lot more out of order when they losing 2-0 but seeing as they won they didnt care.

[Edmund Blackwater]

Ronaldo t didnt act the faggot. .


Come on.
In the name of all that puts blinkers on horses, even the most blinkered manyoo fan knows that he always acts the faggott, except in hotel rooms in London with teenage girls he's plied with booze.
And even the last bit is only a rumour.

[RonnyB]

Come on.
In the name of all that puts blinkers on horses, even the most blinkered manyoo fan knows that he always acts the faggott, except in hotel rooms in London with teenage girls he's plied with booze.
And even the last bit is only a rumour.

He didnt bitch to the media about the tackles he shipped in the game everyone refers to is it?

Also he was one of 2 United players charged in the OT confrontation a year earlier.

Add to that he didnt go running off to Madrid when every english journo was baying for his blood last summer & as a result his team are top of the Prem 7 he's a cert for footballer of the year on current form.

Hardly the mark of a fag.

Note: I still think he's a diver but Vieira has known to fall down once or twice & I see no one call him a fag.

[Killyoursons]

He didnt bitch to the media about the tackles he shipped in the game everyone refers to is it?

Also he was one of 2 United players charged in the OT confrontation a year earlier.

Add to that he didnt go running off to Madrid when every english journo was baying for his blood last summer & as a result his team are top of the Prem 7 he's a cert for footballer of the year on current form.

Hardly the mark of a fag.

Note: I still think he's a diver but Vieira has known to fall down once or twice & I see no one call him a fag.

Charming.

[RonnyB]

Charming.

ya should have used a better word.

[POL]

Hardly the mark of a fag.

fag.your fellow ManYooer won't like that, he has gay friends you know

[Edmund Blackwater]

He didnt bitch to the media about the tackles he shipped in the game everyone refers to is it?

Only recently. He usually has fergie to do that for him, attempting to sway attention from his incessant diving.

Also he was one of 2 United players charged in the OT confrontation a year earlier.
Was he unfairly charged then?

Add to that he didnt go running off to Madrid when every english journo was baying for his blood last summer & as a result his team are top of the Prem 7 he's a cert for footballer of the year on current form.
1: he showed such charachter, didn't he? Wait, no he didn't he demanded to be let go and fergie said not a hope you snivveling little fucker.
and 2: if he wins soccer player of the year, then there's something inherently wrong with the english game.

Hardly the mark of a fag.
What is the mark of a fag?

Note: I still think he's a diver but Vieira has known to fall down once or twice & I see no one call him a fag.
Vieira took his share of dives too, but not everyone else's share as well.

[KolaKubes]

Clicking "view post" for all of those.

Well there's five minutes of my life I'm not getting back.:rolleyes:

[RonnyB]

He didnt bitch to the media about the tackles he shipped in the game everyone refers to is it?

Only recently. He usually has fergie to do that for him, attempting to sway attention from his incessant diving.

Also he was one of 2 United players charged in the OT confrontation a year earlier.
Was he unfairly charged then?

Add to that he didnt go running off to Madrid when every english journo was baying for his blood last summer & as a result his team are top of the Prem 7 he's a cert for footballer of the year on current form.
1: he showed such charachter, didn't he? Wait, no he didn't he demanded to be let go and fergie said not a hope you snivveling little fucker.
and 2: if he wins soccer player of the year, then there's something inherently wrong with the english game.

Hardly the mark of a fag.
What is the mark of a fag?

Note: I still think he's a diver but Vieira has known to fall down once or twice & I see no one call him a fag.
Vieira took his share of dives too, but not everyone else's share as well.

How is there something wrong in the English game if Ronaldo wins Footballer of the Year? Granted he isn't my choice (that would be Scholes) but the guy has 14 Prem goals already & he isn't even a striker.

[KolaKubes]

How is there something wrong in the English game if Ronaldo wins Footballer of the Year? Granted he isn't my choice (that would be Scholes) but the guy has 14 Prem goals already & he isn't even a striker.

I'm leaning towards giving it to Ronaldo and, unlike Scholes, I think he'll be able to contribute consistently from here on in. Scholes is fading a little as the season is going on.

[Edmund Blackwater]

How is there something wrong in the English game if Ronaldo wins Footballer of the Year? Granted he isn't my choice (that would be Scholes) but the guy has 14 Prem goals already & he isn't even a striker.
Van Persie had already missed a good chunk of the season before this injury and has scored 11. Not that I'm suggesting he should be player of the season.
I think it's almost a gimme that Henry will top the charts again, as per usual, after all he is the best striker and player in the league. Again, unless he is outright phenomenal for the rest of the season, I'm not suggesting he should win it.
Essien has had a great season so far, as has Drogba.
They have performed in almost every game, not just against the likes of Watford and Charlton.
As you said, Scholes has played well, pots? No.
Giggs has had a great year, pots? No.
Vidic has been a rock at the back, pots? maybe.
Fabregas? maybe.
Steve Sidwell? maybe. (doesn't play for a fashionable team, you've prob never heard of him.

There are plenty of good performers to choose from. If wrongaldo is a shoe in, then I'm a dutch man.

[RonnyB]

Van Persie had already missed a good chunk of the season before this injury and has scored 11. Not that I'm suggesting he should be player of the season.
I think it's almost a gimme that Henry will top the charts again, as per usual, after all he is the best striker and player in the league. Again, unless he is outright phenomenal for the rest of the season, I'm not suggesting he should win it.
Essien has had a great season so far, as has Drogba.
They have performed in almost every game, not just against the likes of Watford and Charlton.
As you said, Scholes has played well, pots? No.
Giggs has had a great year, pots? No.
Vidic has been a rock at the back, pots? maybe.
Fabregas? maybe.
Steve Sidwell? maybe. (doesn't play for a fashionable team, you've prob never heard of him.

There are plenty of good performers to choose from. If wrongaldo is a shoe in, then I'm a dutch man.

As I've said he's not my choice from what I've seen so far. And yes I have seen Sidwell. bloody good player & all this clap trap of bringing Barton in to the England squad I'd have Sidwell & Nolan in ahead of him, even though he's probably a better tackler than Sidwell & Nolan.

You've mentioned Drogba as having a great season performing in every game. Didnt he go 8 prem games scoring only against Watford. And dont say Essien has been good in every game. He's certainly not a centre half as he showed against the Pool.

Giggs had a good August but has been poor since IMO. The away win at Wigan on his return from injury being his only quality performance that I can think of. Inconsistancy is killing him.

Still as we all know the media seem to form peoples opinions on a lot of things and they've hyped Ronaldo to the last this year.

[STEVIEG]

If Chelsea win the league i'd give one of their players the award (Probably Essien, maybe Drogba if he has a good last 12 games too)
Think they are decided earlier than that though
Up to now i'd say Ronaldo

[Forsberg]

If Chelsea win the league i'd give one of their players the award (Probably Essien, maybe Drogba if he has a good last 12 games too)
Think they are decided earlier than that though
Up to now i'd say Ronaldo


Ya i think voting takes place very early.

I think at the moment Ronaldo just about deserves it, but he's by no means the clear favourite as the media would suggest. I think Essien has been fantastic all season and hopefully his stint at CB is over and he can go back to playing in midfield. They would be my two picks so far but it all depends on what hppens over the next few months.

[ho chi feen]

Ya i think voting takes place very early.

I think at the moment Ronaldo just about deserves it, but he's by no means the clear favourite as the media would suggest. I think Essien has been fantastic all season and hopefully his stint at CB is over and he can go back to playing in midfield. They would be my two picks so far but it all depends on what hppens over the next few months.

Hopefully not.