Top 50 foreigners in the PL ever

[Sound]

Top 5 was:
5. Keane
4. Schmeichel
3. Zola
2. Cantona
1. Henry

I was surprised that Bergkamp (7) didn't make the top 5 and Shergar wasn't even in the top 10.

[POL]

how the fuck did Keane make that Top 5? a fucking joke, he wasn't even in the top 15 foreigners at Utd

[homer jay]

who picked these? another sky sports (football didn't exist before 1992) load of shite?

[Papa Smurf]

Ya, I was well surprise that Van Horseface was only 11th in a pole voted by the public. The top five are class acts but Di Canio ahead of him is a bit much.

[Lamps]

Two of the top 5 struggled to make their national teams. Says it all really.

[POL]

apart from Zola, it should be retitled most overrated

[Sound]

who picked these? another sky sports (football didn't exist before 1992) load of shite?

The thread title does say PL there HJ. Dont make me whoosh you again! ;)

It was picked by the great plebian unwashed on the Skysports website. 1.5M of them apparently.

[Sound]

apart from Zola, it should be retitled most overrated

Anyone want to proffer an alternative top 5?

[Teknique]

Giggsy
Keanie
Yorkie
Irwinie
Shesie/Shemeichalie

[Lamps]

Anyone want to proffer an alternative top 5?

For my money, in no particular order.

Brian Roy.
Regi Blinker
Antonio Nunez
Frank LeBouef
Wiliam Prunier

Honouray mention to the cockney rebel

[POL]

Di Canio
Irwin
Zola
Viera
Berkamp

[Paddy Wagon]

Id maybe swap Bergkamp & Keane but other than that all the top 10 had a huge bearing on how succesful their clubs have been.. No matter how much you dislike a club/player I dont think anyone can complain..

[FL4ZGN]

At least they decided to class us as foreigners in this poll.

Last time they included us as part of the UK.

I also noted that two out of five French players in the top nine were born in Africa but represented France at international level.

Anyone who says that Keane should not be in the top five knows nothing about football.

Your wum technique will not work in this thread.

[Teknique]

Your wum technique will not work in this thread.

I was asked for an alternative top 5

Like any propper memeber of the SFI - I delivered

[BlueSkies]

As far as I know it was voted for by Sky one viewers so I wouldn't read too much into it.

[Forsberg]

I'd have gone for

1 Bergkamp
2 Schimicheal
3 Keane
4 Viera
5 Henry

[Gary]

who picked these? another sky sports (football didn't exist before 1992) load of shite?

well it was entitled top 50 in the premiership

Thought the top 6 was about right, though Bergkamp would have been my top.

I would go for

Bergkamp
Keane
Henry
Zola
Cantona

Laughably Kewell was in the top 25.

[norrie rugby head]

who gives a damn about a scumbag game?

[Paddy Wagon]

who gives a damn about a scumbag game?
Take your rugger bugger gutter talk to another thread

[Lamps]

I was asked for an alternative top 5

Like any propper memeber of the SFI - I delivered

sock it to em Tek, they ask for something and then complain about the accuracy when its given. this is what we are dealing with

[Lamps]

who gives a damn about a scumbag game?

get your pondersome clumsy ass out of this thread

[POL]

Take your rugger bugger gutter talk to another thread

you always get some dirty jock giving you the INTERNET equivalent of wet towel slap on the arse and a knowing look in this threads

[Sound]

For me:
1 Henry
2 Keane
3 Bergkamp
4 Schmeichel
5 Cantona

[xvis]

1 Keane
2 Viera
3 Schmeichel
4 Cantona
5 Henry

[norrie rugby head]

get your pondersome clumsy ass out of this thread


more scum
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIAqD4dzkLM&NR

[norrie rugby head]

you always get some dirty jock giving you the INTERNET equivalent of wet towel slap on the arse and a knowing look in this threads
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0HZcQhkWT8

[norrie rugby head]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=adrHgkgOPws

[norrie rugby head]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a7Fp5rRZBu4

[POL]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3AlIuNsdHE

[norrie rugby head]

gay soccer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmRTWJFm9Gk)

[norrie rugby head]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ntc0kgshzYk

[Paddy Wagon]

5. Bergkamp
4. Zola
3. Schmeichel
2. Cantona
1. Henry

[jungle]

Even as a Chelsea fan I have doubts about Zola belonging there. He played beautiful football, but it's arguable how effective it was. From Chelsea, I'd have to go with Makalele, because to my mind he is the difference between winning the Premiership and challenging hard.

For me

1. Henry
2. Cantona
3. Bergkamp
4. Schmeichel
5. Makalele

[norrie rugby head]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bfu8vc6jzzE


even more scum

[Sound]

gay soccer (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmRTWJFm9Gk)

Is there a point to this anywhere?

I spend a lot of my time defending rugby in general on here and here you are with this nonsense.

What do you think the chances are of the scrum being de-powered at international level. Will inevitable litigation make the decision for the IRFU? How does the refereeing of the scrum at underage level effect our international chances while it is still in use? If you want to talk rugby then please do- but this shit is just silly.

[norrie rugby head]

french kicking
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWYpX6SIe9Q

[Paddy Wagon]

french kicking
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oWYpX6SIe9Q
Are you still waiting for a bite?

[norrie rugby head]

Is there a point to this anywhere?

I spend a lot of my time defending rugby in general on here and here you are with this nonsense.

What do you think the chances are of the scrum being de-powered at international level. Will inevitable litigation make the decision for the IRFU? How does the refereeing of the scrum at underage level effect our international chances while it is still in use? If you want to talk rugby then please do- but this shit is just silly.



just doing a POL/Lamps on it

as for the scrumming, it is already damaging the game.
kids are not scrumming and then starting to play J1/Senior/College rugby and expected to fit right in
it is dangerous and i would not be surprised if there are some more serious injuries because of this

[norrie rugby head]

Are you still waiting for a bite?


got two
POL/Lamps just had to quote and reply

[POL]

just doing a POL/Lamps on it

hehe

you wish

[Lamps]

just doing a POL/Lamps on it


are you for real?

[STEVIEG]

For me

Keane
Cantona
Giggs
Peter S
Prunier

[Teknique]

For me

Keane
Cantona
Giggs
Peter S
Prunier

pretty much the same as mine

[STEVIEG]

pretty much the same as mine


Actually, Wumming aside, throw in Irwin instead of Prunier and you'd defo get 5 of the best

[jungle]

Actually, Wumming aside, throw in Irwin instead of Prunier and you'd defo get 5 of the best
How about the 5 best who played for other teams?

[STEVIEG]

How about the 5 best who played for other teams?


Henry
Viera
Zola
Shearer
Adams

[Sound]

Henry
Viera
Zola
Shearer
Adams

Have Newcastle and London declared themselves independent for merry olde Engerlund?

[STEVIEG]

Have Newcastle and London declared themselves independent for merry olde Engerlund?

Heh heh Top non United players to me is the same as top foreigners

Okay drop Adams and Shearer and throw in Gallas and Petit

[xvis]

standards are slipping

[Sound]

Why is Shevchenko struggling to adapt to the Premiership?
Is Chelsea's new boy simply past his best, or are there other reasons for his early-season troubles?
Rob SmythOctober 4, 2006 11:55 AM
At first, it sounds like one of those ubiquitous and annoying riddles that actually has no answer. Marlon King can do it but Andriy Shevchenko can't. Mark Atkins could do it but Juan Veron couldn't. Thierry Henry and Dennis Bergkamp couldn't do it for a couple of months but then did it brilliantly. Robert Pires took a season before he could do it. Shaun Goater did it from the off. Scandinavians generally do it much better than South Americans. What is it?

Hack life in the Premiership, that's what. Seeing a player as good as Shevchenko struggle so badly is startling and excruciating; while English football is clearly a genre unto itself, no genuinely world-class player should be unable to adapt. Yet the reality is that the purchase of foreign players is such an inexact science - even the master, Arsène Wenger, paid good money for the likes of Pascal Cygan, Kaba Diawara and Oleg Luzhny - that, to borrow from William Goldman's treatise on Hollywood, nobody knows anything: why Shevchenko is struggling, when his struggles will end, whether they will end, or why any world-class players would struggle in England. But here are six possible theories.

1. He just needs time

Arguably, it would be more of a surprise if Shevchenko didn't struggle initially. Most of the greatest foreign players have: Dennis Bergkamp did not score until his eighth game for Arsenal, Thierry Henry until his ninth, during which time both were ridiculed by the tabloids, while Eric Cantona was a bit-part player at Leeds for almost a year before moving across the Pennines to find his natural stage. Indeed, the irony of Shevchenko's woes being exacerbated by the blistering form of Didier Drogba, who for two seasons was apparently not cut out for the Premiership, will not be lost on Jose Mourinho. If the good will out, the great - and Shevchenko is certainly that - should have nothing to worry about.

He just needs time. Generally the chief strugglers have been the attackers. More universal footballers such as Claude Makelele, Gabriel Heinze, Sami Hyypia and Peter Schmeichel have found that their job descriptions have changed very little upon arrival in England. Attackers are different, and yet the perception remains that it is defences which need time to gel; that the back four is the great unrotatable of football. In reality it's the opposite: destruction is intrinsically easier than creation, and attacking players need just as much time as defenders to establish rhythms, connection, understanding.

2. He can't handle the muck and bullets

As Roy Keane said, in reference to Veron, the idea that world-class players cannot handle the "muck and bullets" of the Premiership is nonsense. The notion that English football is too fast, that foreigners don't like it up 'em, is a grotesque oversimplification borne of an almost colonial contempt. If it was as simple as that, England could pick the Watford team and rule the waves. The Premiership is certainly more robust than most leagues, and British beef is not to everyone's taste, but the success of pint-sized technicians like Juninho and Gianfranco Zola suggests it is a long way from being a determining factor. Besides, the likes of Paolo Montero were hardly treading on eggshells while trying to stop Shevchenko in his Serie A days.

3. It's all in his head

Many of the Premiership's greatest flops - Veron, Diego Forlan, Serhiy Rebrov, Albert Luque - have been meek, diffident characters; fairweather friends who squeeze tight to the smooth and recoil at the rough. The same can be said of José Antonio Reyes: he was not so much kicked out of football by the Neville brothers as kicked out of playing his normal game. As his ankles were bitten, so his toes stopped twinkling. Contrast that with Cristiano Ronaldo, who has the mental courage and self-belief to keep knocking at the door no matter how many times he is told where to go.

Reyes and Veron, like Ian Rush when he went to Italy, also exhibited classic symptoms of homesickness. Sometimes, playing football abroad really is like being in a foreign country. Or a player might suffer from personal problems - things which do not relate directly to the job but which impinge significantly upon it. Sometimes, it really can be something as ostensibly straightforward as that: sometimes, for no apparent reason, you get bad vibes which never quite go away. But the fact that Shevchenko, and his wife Kristen Pazik, has occupied as many column inches in the gossip sections of the tabloids as the sports pages suggests that life in London suits him just fine.

4. He is being misused tactically

There is significant precedent here: Veron was signed on a whim in 2001 by an excitable manager who suddenly had money to burn (Ferguson's principal target that summer was Patrick Vieira, an entirely different type of central midfielder) and many feel his failure was down to mismanagement. Hindsight shows he was a poor signing in the first place - United's orchestral midfield had room for only one conductor, the peerless Keane - and then, upon realizing that problem, Ferguson tried to get round it by shunting Veron onto the right of midfield.

In many senses, Veron was a Championship Manager purchase, bought for who he was and what he represented rather than after a conclusive analysis of how he might fit into the team. The same applies to Luque, Rebrov and Kleberson, who were all bought without a specific role in mind. Contrast that with Wenger, who watches players dozens and dozens of times to appraise exactly how they will fit into his team.

There are concerns that Shevchenko, like Veron, is in the wrong place at the right time; that he was bought on status, this time by an excitable owner with money to burn. At Milan he was drip-fed chances by a phalanx of seductively brilliant midfield craftsmen: Andrea Pirlo, Kaka, Clarence Seedorf, Rui Costa. At Chelsea he is more likely to be feeding off long passes from Frank Lampard and Michael Ballack or scavenging for knockdowns from Didier Drogba. Worse still, he is sometimes being used as the nominal wide-right in a 4-3-3 formation, as grotesque a misuse of a natural predator since Johan Cruyff tried to convert Gary Lineker into a total footballer by dumping him on the right wing at Barcelona in 1988.

5. He's out of form

Simple as that. Like Wayne Rooney, Shevchenko hasn't quite recovered from a pre-World Cup injury and his rust is compounding the inevitable teething problems of moving to a new culture, a new club and a new style of play. This is a man who scored 127 goals in 207 games in Serie A, the most sophisticated defensive institution in world football. Once he finds his form and rhythm, the Premiership should be easy pickings.

6. He's past it

Don't be silly.

[STEVIEG]

Why is Shevchenko struggling to adapt to the Premiership?



He'll be fine
The print media are bored at the moment so they have to write something about Rooney and Sheva-this will all be forgotten about in a few weeks

[MonTheHoops]

I think number 4 sounds most like it. Crespo should have been a revelation, Shevchenko should too.

Top players don't always succeed at different clubs but Chelsea seem to have a knack of making fabulous look decidedly average in the system they play at times.

[alpha]

even though they're in a different class, does schevchenko kind of remind you of kezman? the same thing happened to him, and he's never regained form since!!

Top 5 foreigners:

Henry
Irwin
Keane
Zola
Petit

[AmadeusDC]

Why is Shevchenko struggling to adapt to the Premiership?
Is Chelsea's new boy simply past his best, or are there other reasons for his early-season troubles?
Rob SmythOctober 4, 2006 11:55 AM
At first, it sounds like one of those ubiquitous and annoying riddles that actually has no answer. Marlon King can do it but Andriy Shevchenko can't. Mark Atkins could do it but Juan Veron couldn't. Thierry Henry and Dennis Bergkamp couldn't do it for a couple of months but then did it brilliantly. Robert Pires took a season before he could do it. Shaun Goater did it from the off. Scandinavians generally do it much better than South Americans. What is it?

Hack life in the Premiership, that's what. Seeing a player as good as Shevchenko struggle so badly is startling and excruciating; while English football is clearly a genre unto itself, no genuinely world-class player should be unable to adapt. Yet the reality is that the purchase of foreign players is such an inexact science - even the master, Arsène Wenger, paid good money for the likes of Pascal Cygan, Kaba Diawara and Oleg Luzhny - that, to borrow from William Goldman's treatise on Hollywood, nobody knows anything: why Shevchenko is struggling, when his struggles will end, whether they will end, or why any world-class players would struggle in England. But here are six possible theories.

1. He just needs time

Arguably, it would be more of a surprise if Shevchenko didn't struggle initially. Most of the greatest foreign players have: Dennis Bergkamp did not score until his eighth game for Arsenal, Thierry Henry until his ninth, during which time both were ridiculed by the tabloids, while Eric Cantona was a bit-part player at Leeds for almost a year before moving across the Pennines to find his natural stage. Indeed, the irony of Shevchenko's woes being exacerbated by the blistering form of Didier Drogba, who for two seasons was apparently not cut out for the Premiership, will not be lost on Jose Mourinho. If the good will out, the great - and Shevchenko is certainly that - should have nothing to worry about.

He just needs time. Generally the chief strugglers have been the attackers. More universal footballers such as Claude Makelele, Gabriel Heinze, Sami Hyypia and Peter Schmeichel have found that their job descriptions have changed very little upon arrival in England. Attackers are different, and yet the perception remains that it is defences which need time to gel; that the back four is the great unrotatable of football. In reality it's the opposite: destruction is intrinsically easier than creation, and attacking players need just as much time as defenders to establish rhythms, connection, understanding.

2. He can't handle the muck and bullets

As Roy Keane said, in reference to Veron, the idea that world-class players cannot handle the "muck and bullets" of the Premiership is nonsense. The notion that English football is too fast, that foreigners don't like it up 'em, is a grotesque oversimplification borne of an almost colonial contempt. If it was as simple as that, England could pick the Watford team and rule the waves. The Premiership is certainly more robust than most leagues, and British beef is not to everyone's taste, but the success of pint-sized technicians like Juninho and Gianfranco Zola suggests it is a long way from being a determining factor. Besides, the likes of Paolo Montero were hardly treading on eggshells while trying to stop Shevchenko in his Serie A days.

3. It's all in his head

Many of the Premiership's greatest flops - Veron, Diego Forlan, Serhiy Rebrov, Albert Luque - have been meek, diffident characters; fairweather friends who squeeze tight to the smooth and recoil at the rough. The same can be said of José Antonio Reyes: he was not so much kicked out of football by the Neville brothers as kicked out of playing his normal game. As his ankles were bitten, so his toes stopped twinkling. Contrast that with Cristiano Ronaldo, who has the mental courage and self-belief to keep knocking at the door no matter how many times he is told where to go.

Reyes and Veron, like Ian Rush when he went to Italy, also exhibited classic symptoms of homesickness. Sometimes, playing football abroad really is like being in a foreign country. Or a player might suffer from personal problems - things which do not relate directly to the job but which impinge significantly upon it. Sometimes, it really can be something as ostensibly straightforward as that: sometimes, for no apparent reason, you get bad vibes which never quite go away. But the fact that Shevchenko, and his wife Kristen Pazik, has occupied as many column inches in the gossip sections of the tabloids as the sports pages suggests that life in London suits him just fine.

4. He is being misused tactically

There is significant precedent here: Veron was signed on a whim in 2001 by an excitable manager who suddenly had money to burn (Ferguson's principal target that summer was Patrick Vieira, an entirely different type of central midfielder) and many feel his failure was down to mismanagement. Hindsight shows he was a poor signing in the first place - United's orchestral midfield had room for only one conductor, the peerless Keane - and then, upon realizing that problem, Ferguson tried to get round it by shunting Veron onto the right of midfield.

In many senses, Veron was a Championship Manager purchase, bought for who he was and what he represented rather than after a conclusive analysis of how he might fit into the team. The same applies to Luque, Rebrov and Kleberson, who were all bought without a specific role in mind. Contrast that with Wenger, who watches players dozens and dozens of times to appraise exactly how they will fit into his team.

There are concerns that Shevchenko, like Veron, is in the wrong place at the right time; that he was bought on status, this time by an excitable owner with money to burn. At Milan he was drip-fed chances by a phalanx of seductively brilliant midfield craftsmen: Andrea Pirlo, Kaka, Clarence Seedorf, Rui Costa. At Chelsea he is more likely to be feeding off long passes from Frank Lampard and Michael Ballack or scavenging for knockdowns from Didier Drogba. Worse still, he is sometimes being used as the nominal wide-right in a 4-3-3 formation, as grotesque a misuse of a natural predator since Johan Cruyff tried to convert Gary Lineker into a total footballer by dumping him on the right wing at Barcelona in 1988.

5. He's out of form

Simple as that. Like Wayne Rooney, Shevchenko hasn't quite recovered from a pre-World Cup injury and his rust is compounding the inevitable teething problems of moving to a new culture, a new club and a new style of play. This is a man who scored 127 goals in 207 games in Serie A, the most sophisticated defensive institution in world football. Once he finds his form and rhythm, the Premiership should be easy pickings.

6. He's past it

Don't be silly.

I enjoyed reading that article. To be honest I think Sheva will start scoring for fun soon. Chelsea are just too good to not create bucket loads of chances and some of the teams they play are so overmatched that forwards can't help but score against them. Also, he doesn't have to worry as much about being dropped as other strikers do. When Ranieri was fucking about there were loads of strikers and you could be switched for nothing. Kezman even was always under pressure cause there was just one spot. Sheva is/will be given more time and sooner or later he'll come good. Personally I think he'll have 11 or 12 league goals this season and go into the high teens next year. He might also be the guy Chelsea have missed in the Champions League. The genius who can pick it up when the overrated disappear (eg. Claude Mak coming to the fore when Lampard disappeared against Barca). -AmadeusDC-

[Forsberg]

even though they're in a different class, does schevchenko kind of remind you of kezman? the same thing happened to him, and he's never regained form since!!



No comparison.

Kezman had never proven himself at the top level before he joined Chelsea. Shevchenko has been one of the best strikers in the world for the last 8 or so years

[Sound]

He'll be fine
The print media are bored at the moment so they have to write something about Rooney and Sheva-this will all be forgotten about in a few weeks

I agree absolutely but it's an interesting treatise. Especially the bits about how long some took to settle or even get a goal. I mean, there was a tulip on here this morning writing off Kuyt after 5 games despite the fact that he has already gotten two goals! I'd love to see some of the reprting when genii like Bergkamp and Henry were struggling.

[STEVIEG]

I agree absolutely but it's an interesting treatise. Especially the bits about how long some took to settle or even get a goal. I mean, there was a tulip on here this morning writing off Kuyt after 5 games despite the fact that he has already gotten two goals! I'd love to see some of the reprting when genii like Bergkamp and Henry were struggling.


Yeah, Kuyt looks like a good player i presume he was messing
All players deserve a chance

[mart]

No comparison.

Kezman had never proven himself at the top level before he joined Chelsea. Shevchenko has been one of the best strikers in the world for the last 8 or so years

thats why i said "even though they're a different class"

[homer jay]

The thread title does say PL there HJ. Dont make me whoosh you again! ;)

yeah i saw that, thanks. my point was, why was the survey or vote confined to the premiership?

It was picked by the great plebian unwashed on the Skysports website. 1.5M of them apparently.

answers my question then ;-)

anyway, doesn't matter. for the record...

1.henry
2.keane
3.zola
4.cantona
5.bergkamp

[ho chi feen]

Silenzi
Vargas
Amokachi
Darcheville
Luzhny

Oh, and not forgetting
Stepanovs.

[ho chi feen]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bfu8vc6jzzE


even more scum


Class!

[Superior]

He'll be fine
The print media are bored at the moment so they have to write something about Rooney and Sheva-this will all be forgotten about in a few weeks


Always on about the print media...
Backstabber!

[STEVIEG]

Always on about the print media...
Backstabber!

Well the radio are wankers too to be fairness!

[ho chi feen]

Well the radio are wankers too to be fairness!


Giz a shout out to Niall and Timmy Fitz there, willa?

[STEVIEG]

Giz a shout out to Niall and Timmy Fitz there, willa?

Will do (goes back to work)

[ho chi feen]

Will do (goes back to work)


Listening in now, so you'd better!

[ho chi feen]

Will do (goes back to work)


Hahahahahahahaahahah ahaha!

"Two of our most loyal listeners"

Legend!

What track did ya say they liked?

[Aphex]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bfu8vc6jzzE


even more scum

how did i miss that?

great clip, yay for youtube!

[Loftydog]

Will do (goes back to work)

You work? doing what?

[Philby]

Purely from a contribution to the the Premiership (and their respective clubs) and not necessarilly natural ability I'd go for the following top 5:

1. Keane - for all his faults he was their driving force for many years during their most successful period
2. Bergkamp - absolutely gifted. Gave the premiership many of it's most beautiful moments
3. Henry - perhaps the most talented player to have graced the premiership.
4. Cantona - a maverick, fabulously skilfull and gave the premiership it's most contraversial moment
5. Schmeichel - changed the way keepers approach one-on-ones, never let his errors get him down and got his side out of jail more times than Fergie would care to remember

hurts me to say it..

[ho chi feen]

Purely from a contribution to the the Premiership (and their respective clubs) and not necessarilly natural ability I'd go for the following top 5:

1. Keane - for all his faults he was their driving force for many years during their most successful period
2. Bergkamp - absolutely gifted. Gave the premiership many of it's most beautiful moments
3. Henry - perhaps the most talented player to have graced the premiership.
4. Cantona - a maverick, fabulously skilfull and gave the premiership it's most contraversial moment
5. Schmeichel - changed the way keepers approach one-on-ones, never let his errors get him down and got his side out of jail more times than Fergie would care to remember

hurts me to say it..


Wot, no Gallas? I'll bet.

[Forsberg]

Silenzi
Vargas
Amokachi
Darcheville
Luzhny

Oh, and not forgetting
Stepanovs.

Hey .... Ammo was decent when he was given a chance . But he didn't fit in to Royle's "dogs of War" plans cos he wanted to play football. He'll always be fondly remembered by evertonians

Now . Bakayoko is a different story

[Superdave]

Pretty much the same 5 coming from everyone.

No mentions for Klinsmann or Ravanelli? both 30+ strikers in their hayday! I'll always put klinsmann in the top 5 for the way he blew the game apart when he arrived.
A slightly alternative 5:

1. Zola
2. Keane
3. Klinsmann
4. Overmars
5. Hyypia

[Paddy Wagon]

Pretty much the same 5 coming from everyone.

No mentions for Klinsmann or Ravanelli? both 30+ strikers in their hayday! I'll always put klinsmann in the top 5 for the way he blew the game apart when he arrived.
A slightly alternative 5:

1. Zola
2. Keane
3. Klinsmann
4. Overmars
5. Hyypia
Hehe

[Philby]

True enough, Hyppia was a ridiculously overpriced & overhyped import who did nothing to steady Liverpool's defence. Awful purchase.

[Up For The Ba]

Sometimes, playing football abroad really is like being in a foreign country.





How insightful !

[Sound]

Hehe

Eh?

[Sound]

How insightful !

(c) I. Rush.

[Up For The Ba]

A few points on that article about Shevchenko and some of the other comments that were said afterwards, and these are only my opinions;

1: There is no doubt in my head that Shevchenko is still the most complete forward in the game.

2: I think if he was playing with United he would already have 5/6 goals to his name. The system as Chelsea is definitly going to hurt him and hurt his reputation.

3: The comment about Watford is bollocks. When English teams play against each other you are going to get a high tempo game. When English teams play against foreign opposition they are more often than not forced to play a much slower tempo because the opposition dictates the play with a more measured form of posession football. In other words, there are definitly foreign players who come to the premiership and dont like the pace of the game, Veron is probably the best example because anybody who would question his ability as a footballer would want his head examined.

4: Crespo was mentioned. In my opinion he has been one of the top 5 strikers in the world over the past decade. When he got his chance, he generally took it, but more often than not he wasnt given a prolonged run in the team.

In Summary, Chelsea`s new signings as we all know have forced them to play a very narrow system, and unless Shevchenko has the likes of a Rui Costa, Kaka behind him (which he doesnt) he will become a spectator in games for long periods through no fault of his own.

[Up For The Ba]

My Top 5 Foreigners in the Premiership:

1: Henry
2: Cantona
3: Keane
4: Bergkamp
5: Vieira


I think these 5 contributed more than anybody else to title winning campaigns.

Notable absentees - Schmiechel, who I`d have really close to this selection and Makalele (dont think he has been here long enough to rank him that highly).

[Paddy Wagon]

Eh?
Honestly Hypia inthe top 5 come off the stage, a good player who didnt cost a huge amount and has done well but in fairness to put him in the top 5 ahead of players like Juninho, Di Canio, Bergkamp, Cantona, Henry etc is surely a piss take..

[Sound]

Honestly Hypia inthe top 5 come off the stage, a good player who didnt cost a huge amount and has done well but in fairness to put him in the top 5 ahead of players like Juninho, Di Canio, Bergkamp, Cantona, Henry etc is surely a piss take..

It was an alternative top 5. He actually came 9th in the poll on the TV.

[Superdave]

Honestly Hypia inthe top 5 come off the stage, a good player who didnt cost a huge amount and has done well but in fairness to put him in the top 5 ahead of players like Juninho, Di Canio, Bergkamp, Cantona, Henry etc is surely a piss take..

defending is part of football too. are you ossie in disguise?!!

[doppellanger]

My top 5

1. Cantona
2. Vieira
3. Keane
4. Schmeichel
5. David O'Leary (who played in the Premiership just at the tag end of his career)

I support Arsenal but I don't think any player had such an effect as Cantona.

Bergkamp is, in my opinion, a flawed player, which is why he does not make my top 5. He does not have a good temperament or attitude.

[homer jay]

My top 5

1. Cantona
2. Vieira
3. Keane
4. Schmeichel
5. David O'Leary (who played in the Premiership just at the tag end of his career)

I support Arsenal but I don't think any player had such an effect as Cantona.

Bergkamp is, in my opinion, a flawed player, which is why he does not make my top 5. He does not have a good temperament or attitude.

and roy keane does?

[doppellanger]

and roy keane does?
team attitude. Bergkamp is a coward and a selfish git. But he does have skill.

[Lamps]

My top 5

1. Cantona
2. Vieira
3. Keane
4. Schmeichel
5. David O'Leary (who played in the Premiership just at the tag end of his career)

I support Arsenal but I don't think any player had such an effect as Cantona.

Bergkamp is, in my opinion, a flawed player, which is why he does not make my top 5. He does not have a good temperament or attitude.

Yet Eric le Bottleur tops your list.

[doppellanger]

Yet Eric le Bottleur tops your list.

Bergkamp is a coward because he is afraid to get hurt, and that is one of the reasons he is dangerous going into tackles.

Keane, Cantona and Vieira, for that matter, were not afraid to get hurt in the tackle and were much better team players than Bergkamp.

[Lamps]

Bergkamp is a coward because he is afraid to get hurt, and that is one of the reasons he is dangerous going into tackles.

Keane, Cantona and Vieira, for that matter, were not afraid to get hurt in the tackle and were much better team players than Bergkamp.

what are you on about, cantona wasn't a tackler besides the time's he tried something sneaky.

[doppellanger]

what are you on about, cantona wasn't a tackler besides the time's he tried something sneaky.

I didn't say he could tackle, I said he was not afraid to get hurt.

When I'm talking about attitude, maybe you guys understand something differrent by it. Roy Keane was a perfectionist, about his own play and others and that spilled over into aggression sometimes. Aggression is necessary in football anyway. But the proof is in the pudding and Cantona and Keane were among the more successful players in terms of Premiership honours.

Giggs and Irwin probably have more Premiership medals but you can't argue that Keane and Cantona did not have a bigger influence on the teams they played in.

[STEVIEG]

I didn't say he could tackle, I said he was not afraid to get hurt.

When I'm talking about attitude, maybe you guys understand something differrent by it. Roy Keane was a perfectionist, about his own play and others and that spilled over into aggression sometimes. Aggression is necessary in football anyway. But the proof is in the pudding and Cantona and Keane were among the more successful players in terms of Premiership honours.

Giggs and Irwin probably have more Premiership medals but you can't argue that Keane and Cantona did not have a bigger influence on the teams they played in.

Yup, and at least they tackled with their legs and not their elbows

[Lamps]

Yup, and at least they tackled with their legs and not their elbows

Stevie your understanding of soccer is frankly embarassing. By all means yap away about supporting your beloved manyoo, but don't ever get involved in the serious analysis.

[POL]

he's good at descriptive analysis of trips to Old Trafford and what it means to be a "red" but when it boils down to it he's basic knowledge of the game is suspect to say the least, in fact rudimentary

[STEVIEG]

Stevie your understanding of soccer is frankly embarassing. By all means yap away about supporting your beloved manyoo, but don't ever get involved in the serious analysis.

Just cause you say it enough it won't mean it's true
Now Xvis has left ya off his leash for awhile i'm sure he wants you back now like a good boy
And please try to analyse elbows Berkamp with the same cynicism you reserve for Keane and Cantona
God, the 90's damaged you beyond repair

[STEVIEG]

he's good at descriptive analysis of trips to Old Trafford and what it means to be a "red" but when it boils down to it he's basic knowledge of the game is suspect to say the least, in fact rudimentary


http://www.peoplesrepublico fcork.com/~peoplesr/forums/showthread.php?t=845 48

[Lamps]

Just cause you say it enough it won't mean it's true
Now Xvis has left ya off his leash for awhile i'm sure he wants you back now like a good boy
And please try to analyse elbows Berkamp with the same cynicism you reserve for Keane and Cantona
God, the 90's damaged you beyond repair

2me lad, your descending to Fitzy/Lame depths now. Imagining INTERNET victories because people dare to question the record of the mighty Alex.

If Bergkamp elbowed someone it was wrong, have you heard me claim otherwise.

[STEVIEG]

. Imagining INTERNET victories



Now i'm really laughing
The irony is actually overwhelming:)

[Sound]

http://www.peoplesrepublico fcork.com/~peoplesr/forums/showthread.php?t=845 48

These flirtations with the ball-shavers are worrying. I'm all for a good wum but this is kiddie's stuff. And to claim it as any kind of experiment is lying that Bertie would be proud of.

Disappointing.

[POL]

steve's really on the rack

[STEVIEG]

These flirtations with the ball-shavers are worrying. I'm all for a good wum but this is kiddie's stuff. And to claim it as any kind of experiment is lying that Bertie would be proud of.

Disappointing.


Maybe he is finding his own level?

[POL]

These flirtations with the ball-shavers are worrying. I'm all for a good wum but this is kiddie's stuff. And to claim it as any kind of experiment is lying that Bertie would be proud of.

Disappointing.

haha, yes my postings on the morons forum are to be taken seriously alright

dissapointing...

[STEVIEG]

haha, yes my postings on the morons forum are to be taken seriously alright



Rattled?

[POL]

Rattled?

bottled?

[Sound]

haha, yes my postings on the morons forum are to be taken seriously alright

dissapointing...

It's to be expected really. You've spent too much time over there and have obviously been infected with a little bit of stoopid.

[POL]

It's to be expected really. You've spent too much time over there and have obviously been infected with a little bit of stoopid.

I'll do anything for the love a good wum..

[STEVIEG]

Well welcome back
It's a bit too easy over there

[POL]

Well welcome back
It's a bit too easy over there

Lets get one thing straight steve, the sports forum is sacrosanct. A wum free zone, never forget that

[Lamps]

Stevie2Me whats after happening to the old you. Actively trying to antagonise the SFI, admiting to wummery. I remember the old StevieG character who wouldn't say boo to a mouse, mr diplomat. Once I tricked you into so some bender comment which you quickly retracted, today you using the word bum chum as some sort of bait to start a scrap.

Think of your fans will you. Just cos Rio's at it don't make it right

[STEVIEG]

Stevie2Me whats after happening to the old you. Actively trying to antagonise the SFI, admiting to wummery. I remember the old StevieG character who wouldn't say boo to a mouse, mr diplomat. Once I tricked you into so some bender comment which you quickly retracted, today you using the word bum chum as some sort of bait to start a scrap.

Think of your fans will you. Just cos Rio's at it don't make it right

I have wummed manys a time here it's only the internet

Being totally PC and being non homophobic are two different things

I'm cool with whatever choices any of you decide to make BTW

[Lamps]

I have wummed manys a time here it's only the internet

Being totally PC and being non homophobic are two different things

I'm cool with whatever choices any of you decide to make BTW

2Me lad, you couldn't WUM a pissed Fitzy with an electric WUMMER.

So are you saying its cool to make innuendo regarding the homosexuality of people as some sort of joke?
you've gone too far this time stevie, too far

[doppellanger]

ooh-ah Cantona!
say ooh-ah Cantona!

[STEVIEG]

2Me lad, you couldn't WUM a pissed Fitzy with an electric WUMMER.

So are you saying its cool to make innuendo regarding the homosexuality of people as some sort of joke?
you've gone too far this time stevie, too far

I feel your moral outrage
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Hard luck, you were beaten by the better man

[Lamps]

I feel your moral outrage
zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz
Hard luck, you were beaten by the better man

You know Stevie2Me is struggling when the zzzzzzzzz are out.

He's pressed the ejector seat.

[STEVIEG]

You know Stevie2Me is struggling when the zzzzzzzzz are out.

He's pressed the ejector seat.


zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz z

[STEVIEG]

ooh-ah Cantona!
say ooh-ah Cantona!


Ohh-ah ohh-ah
ohh-ah C-A-N-T-O-N-A

[Lamps]

The SFI takes on Stevie2Me

http://www.worth1000.com/entries/3000/3338_w.jpg

[STEVIEG]

The SFI takes on Stevie2Me

http://www.worth1000.com/entries/3000/3338_w.jpg


Let's have a drink, a drink, a drink
for Eric the King, the King, the King

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYLA2-A8bcU

[Lamps]

Let's have a drink, a drink, a drink
for Kric the King, the King, the King

too late, got it


Indeed

Kric the King, sounds like some vahallian god,

lord of the bottle

[STEVIEG]

too late, got it


Indeed

Kric the King, sounds like some vahallian god,

lord of the bottle

He Kruly was Inkredible
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LauwKT1_n0M

[General Michael Collins]

Dont think anyone can argue about Henry getting top place.Would have had Bergkamp and Zola ahead of Cantona,who never delivered on the european or international stages.

[STEVIEG]

Dont think anyone can argue about Henry getting top place.Would have had Bergkamp and Zola ahead of Cantona,who never delivered on the european or international stages.

Premiership winner
1992
1993
1994 Double and scored twice in cup final
1996 Double and scored winner in cup final
1997
Zola ahead of Cantona
Sometimes i really do wonder..............

[General Michael Collins]

Premiership winner
1992
1993
1994 Double and scored twice in cup final
1996 Double and scored winner in cup final
1997
Zola ahead of Cantona
Sometimes i really do wonder..............
If you read my message you ll see that i said that he never delivered on EUROPEAN or INTERNATIONAL stages.I dont see any European Cup,European Championship or World Cup winners madals on your list?

[STEVIEG]

First post in the thread

Top 50 foreigners in the PL ever

[Forsberg]

If you read my message you ll see that i said that he never delivered on EUROPEAN or INTERNATIONAL stages.I dont see any European Cup,European Championship or World Cup winners madals on your list?


But the poll was for Premiership players. ie what they acheived in the prem.

[General Michael Collins]

But the poll was for Premiership players. ie what they acheived in the prem.
It was about the best foreigner to play in the premiership.Henry has world cup and european championship winners medals-cantona dosnt.

[Forsberg]

It was about the best foreigner to play in the premiership.Henry has world cup and european championship winners medals-cantona dosnt.

George Weah , Davor Suker, Andriy Shevchenko... etc etc

[STEVIEG]

It was about the best foreigner to play in the premiership.Henry has world cup and european championship winners medals-cantona dosnt.

Cantona won Premiership medals with two different teams
Was the cornerstone of both campaigns
Won every Premeirship season that he played a reasonale part in
Dominated the league and cup for 5 years
Didn't get on with France and never made an impact properly

Henry has been great in the premiership
Had not much to do with Frances world cup victory but was good in 2002 and reasonable in 2006
A European dissapointment (like Eric) for years (till this year) but his team weren't restricted by a silly foreigner rule (which would have rightly fucked Arsenal)

Overall, and let's stick to the thread, Cantona>Henry as a foreign player there

[AmadeusDC]

Without thinking about it too much...........

Looking at the full footballing picture, respect, achievements, longevity etc I'd have it

(1)Henry
(2)Keane
(3)Cantona
(4)Vieira
(5)Schmeichel

For sheer effect on the English game, media, style, highlight moments, more than just effectiveness on the field and importance to the team while they were here I'd say
(1)Henry
(2)Cantona
(3)Klinnsmann
(4)Ginola
(5-7) in no particular order Overmars/Zola/Bergkamp

Ronaldo will fly up that list if he keeps progressing the way he has and Van Persie and Fabregas look really special at Arsenal.

-AmadeusDC-

[General Michael Collins]

Cantona won Premiership medals with two different teams
Was the cornerstone of both campaigns
Won every Premeirship season that he played a reasonale part in
Dominated the league and cup for 5 years
Didn't get on with France and never made an impact properly

Henry has been great in the premiership
Had not much to do with Frances world cup victory but was good in 2002 and reasonable in 2006
A European dissapointment (like Eric) for years (till this year) but his team weren't restricted by a silly foreigner rule (which would have rightly fucked Arsenal)

Overall, and let's stick to the thread, Cantona>Henry as a foreign player there
Fair enough.By the way Cantona didnt win a premiership medal with Leeds.It was a first division championship.

[STEVIEG]

Fair enough.By the way Cantona didnt win a premiership medal with Leeds.It was a first division championship.


yup, my bad

I should really remember
1992 nearly killed me at the time

[General Michael Collins]

yup, my bad

I should really remember
1992 nearly killed me at the time
Im sure it was as bad the following year for leeds fans seeing cantona win the premiership with there most hated of rivals!!

[BlueSkies]

I'd be inclined to agree with you Stevie, but you do yourself no favours with this 'silly foreigners rule' nonsense. First of all, this rule applied to every club in the EU, not just Man United. Secondly, do you think top English clubs would be signing so many foreigners if the rule was still in effect?

[STEVIEG]

Im sure it was as bad following year for leeds fans seeing cantona win the premiership with there most hated of rivals!!


Absolutely
I was at his last game for United against Leeds at OT on a feezing cold Christmas a few years later and the Leeds fans, to a man, has their tops off and spent the entire game chanting "Kill, kill, Cantona"
He scored the winner too that day which drove them over the edge

[Superdave]

Let's have a drink, a drink, a drink
for Eric the King, the King, the King

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PYLA2-A8bcU


I personally always thought Cantona was hugely overated. But at the time i did my best to justify all thing united being hugely overated!

I'll say this though - that's probably the best celebration in the premiership. pure class!

[mrMousey]

Keano
Irwin
Schmichael
Giggs
VanNR

[AmadeusDC]

Keano
Irwin
Schmichael
Giggs
VanNR

Man City fan???

-AmadeusDC-