Cloyne SGM - the reality

[Corcaigh32]

As I understand it the SGM motion was shot down on a procedural technicality by the CB (JOS) grouping within the Cloyne club. The motion will be resubmitted and the information I have is that the majority of the club members will support the motion.

[wunhunglo]

As I understand it the SGM motion was shot down on a procedural technicality by the CB (JOS) grouping within the Cloyne club. The motion will be resubmitted and the information I have is that the majority of the club members will support the motion.

Jerry O'Sullivan will have been carefully tutored by Frank Murphy and the motion will be again ruled out of order. Probably Rule 2336 paragraph 11 line 86...whereby it is clearly stated any member who has not been to mass everyday for the last 42 years automatically gives up his right to vote on any matter.

[Poison]

You must wonder does Frank plug himself into the rulebook when he goes to sleep at night.

[smallball1]

Listen Corchaigh, you wouldn't know jack shit about it, but many do not want to have SGM's as they fear that clubs will split, and they reckon that the carryon of the Board, Gerald AND the players doesn't justify splitting clubs.

I know of 2 highprofile exits from 1 particular club over this shite already.
Cloyne may have treid to duck the bullett on this one. If it comes back in, maybe the O'Sullivans will leave en masse. Leave it to that Cusack to sort it out.

[wunhunglo]

I know of 2 highprofile exits from 1 particular club over this shite already.
.


and the names???

[blocker]

Listen Corchaigh, you wouldn't know jack shit about it, but many do not want to have SGM's as they fear that clubs will split, and they reckon that the carryon of the Board, Gerald AND the players doesn't justify splitting clubs.

I know of 2 highprofile exits from 1 particular club over this shite already.
Cloyne may have treid to duck the bullett on this one. If it comes back in, maybe the O'Sullivans will leave en masse. Leave it to that Cusack to sort it out.

We all know you who have breakfast every morning with Smallball and what shit you have to listen to! Is this the same O'Sullivan who is acting as Franks mouthpiece quoting rules he didnt know existed 3 months ago while giving his 2 sons 2 fingers.

[smallball1]

and the names???


If you knew Cork GAA , you'd probably be aware of them.

Point is, SIPTU and the Board deserve each other. Instransigent wankers the lot of em.

[smallball1]

We all know you who have breakfast every morning with Smallball and what shit you have to listen to! Is this the same O'Sullivan who is acting as Franks mouthpiece quoting rules he didnt know existed 3 months ago while giving his 2 sons 2 fingers.

I got a PM saying I was Franks nephew of some such. I aint. You do not have to be related to Frank to see the other side of this argument.
Gerry O'Sullivan is not anyones mouthpiece.

Now as for Donal Og Cusack....... splits the players into little groups, tactics adopted from the hard left trade union movement. A divisive, controlling, malignant influence. Him and Frank have a lot more in common than people care to mention.....

[Poison]

If you knew Cork GAA , you'd probably be aware of them.

Point is, SIPTU and the Board deserve each other. Instransigent wankers the lot of em.

Maybe the loss of these people is only good for Cork GAA anyway.I am sure if they were supportive of the players they would not have walked.The reason people would walk now is because they know change is coming to their old fashioned ways and ideas.Hopefully a lot more will walk in the coming months and we will have a lot better and more fair system running the GAA in Cork.

[Barry K O Bama]

Smallball and his ilk stand discredited in the eyes of 'Genuine' Cork Supporters.

What has happened in Cloyne is yet another example of why thousands of Cork Supporters will march to Pairc Ui Chaoimh next Sunday - Supporting the 08 Hurlers, Democracy and Decency.

I spoke to an ordinary club member in Cloyne today and found out exactly what happened:-

The Management Committee met on Monday last and decided (by a majority decision) to hold a Special General Meeting (SGM) to allow every member the opportunity to execise his vote on a fair and democratic basis.

Members were informed in Writing that the SGM would take place on Thursday last. But the Frankmen in Cloyne (There are a few in most clubs) raised an objection (probably advised by Frank) that the SGM was not valid due to a small technical procedural omission in Monday's Man. Committee Metting.

The club then had no choice but cancel the SGM.


This is more of Frank's Gerrymandering. Democracy Frank Style.

Pat Casey then leaks the story to his friends and former employers in the Kerry Examiner and suddenly we have headlines that ''Cloyne decide not to hold a meeting''

This is yet another blatant and reprehensible attempt by Frank and his small band of extremist supporters to deny democracy.

Cork is proud is its title 'The Rebel County' - we have always stood for decency and democracy.

Frank - Be there on the 8th March and we will deliver our message once again in a clear and dignified manner.

[KolaKubes]

I've been attacked in years gone by for complaining about Frank getting Cork players off the hook on procedural grounds.

The idea of an amateur code having its rules applied to the letter but not in the spirit disgusts me, frankly.

[blocker]

Bishopstown have done the very same re their meeting! This I presume is due to member Bob Honahan. People like Bob are the "sickness in Cork GAA" that John Gardiner spoke about a while back!

[bugsy]

Bishopstown have done the very same re their meeting! This I presume is due to member Bob Honahan. People like Bob are the "sickness in Cork GAA" that John Gardiner spoke about a while back!

Bob's nephew (most of us didn't know he was until afterwards) kicked up a fuss at our meeting too. We didn't have the 10 days to call an EGM if we wanted to do it before tonight's divisional board meeting. All members were notified of it though and most were fine with it. He spent nearly an hour complaining how it had no standing and a vote couldn't be taken.

This is, of course, all technically correct but our chairman said the results would only be going to the players at another meeting which had no standing so he was doing the vote. Small Bob said 'there's a right way and a wrong way to do things' and the chairman said 'sure we'll do it the wrong way so.'

Although right by the rules, this 'ye can't vote at this meeting' stuff is essentially saying people are not entitled to have a personal opinion on a matter. The results wouldn't be any different at an EGM 10 days later anyway. Ridiculous. Btw, 1 person (guess who) didn't vote and 1 voted against the players, resounding majority.

[glue]

Bob's nephew

Who is that

[blocker]

Bob's nephew (most of us didn't know he was until afterwards) kicked up a fuss at our meeting too. We didn't have the 10 days to call an EGM if we wanted to do it before tonight's divisional board meeting. All members were notified of it though and most were fine with it. He spent nearly an hour complaining how it had no standing and a vote couldn't be taken.

This is, of course, all technically correct but our chairman said the results would only be going to the players at another meeting which had no standing so he was doing the vote. Small Bob said 'there's a right way and a wrong way to do things' and the chairman said 'sure we'll do it the wrong way so.'

Although right by the rules, this 'ye can't vote at this meeting' stuff is essentially saying people are not entitled to have a personal opinion on a matter. The results wouldn't be any different at an EGM 10 days later anyway. Ridiculous. Btw, 1 person (guess who) didn't vote and 1 voted against the players, resounding majority.


Fair fucks to your club and applying common sense! What a load of bullshit hiding behind the rulebook like this

[bugsy]

Who is that

I don't want to be naming guys, it's a small club!

A long way from btown though, so it was a surprise to us.

[bugsy]

Fair fucks to your club and applying common sense! What a load of bullshit hiding behind the rulebook like this

And that majority is from an exclusively football club, lots of older guys too.

Even still, all junior clubs only have 16 votes, our delegate said the CB top table have 20 themselves so that's a big head start. A false democracy he called the whole thing.

[peopleluas]

Bob's nephew (most of us didn't know he was until afterwards) kicked up a fuss at our meeting too. We didn't have the 10 days to call an EGM if we wanted to do it before tonight's divisional board meeting. All members were notified of it though and most were fine with it. He spent nearly an hour complaining how it had no standing and a vote couldn't be taken.

This is, of course, all technically correct but our chairman said the results would only be going to the players at another meeting which had no standing so he was doing the vote. Small Bob said 'there's a right way and a wrong way to do things' and the chairman said 'sure we'll do it the wrong way so.'

Although right by the rules, this 'ye can't vote at this meeting' stuff is essentially saying people are not entitled to have a personal opinion on a matter. The results wouldn't be any different at an EGM 10 days later anyway. Ridiculous. Btw, 1 person (guess who) didn't vote and 1 voted against the players, resounding majority.

The issue with the notice of the SGM being shorter tan 10 days is not that it invalidates decisions made at the SGM. It simply means that those present at the AGM can VOTE to ajourn the SGM on the basis of the notice being too short. refer to the club rules - it's pretty clear. See the actual rule:

"8.15 Failure to comply strictly with the time limits set out in this Constitution and Rules or the non receipt of Notice of a Meeting by any persons entitled to receive notice shall not invalidate the proceedings at that meeting, but shall entitle the majority of members present to seek and be granted an adjournment of the meeting to such date by which they would be given an adequate time to be furnished with and consider the contents of any relevant documentation."

Having said this, this appears to be a long struggle - if your SGM is next week rather than this week, it'll still get the point across as to what the members think.

[Paddy Wagon]

Cloyne could do alot worse than try and get their own house in order before calling an SGM on the cork hurlers dispute!
The club is in DISARRAY, and is gonna need alot of effort and work by the new chairman and his new committee if they are to be competitive this year never mind win that coveted Senior Championship.

[Rebelred]

Smallball and his ilk stand discredited in the eyes of 'Genuine' Cork Supporters.

What has happened in Cloyne is yet another example of why thousands of Cork Supporters will march to Pairc Ui Chaoimh next Sunday - Supporting the 08 Hurlers, Democracy and Decency.

I spoke to an ordinary club member in Cloyne today and found out exactly what happened:-

The Management Committee met on Monday last and decided (by a majority decision) to hold a Special General Meeting (SGM) to allow every member the opportunity to execise his vote on a fair and democratic basis.

Members were informed in Writing that the SGM would take place on Thursday last. But the Frankmen in Cloyne (There are a few in most clubs) raised an objection (probably advised by Frank) that the SGM was not valid due to a small technical procedural omission in Monday's Man. Committee Metting.

The club then had no choice but cancel the SGM.


This is more of Frank's Gerrymandering. Democracy Frank Style.

Pat Casey then leaks the story to his friends and former employers in the Kerry Examiner and suddenly we have headlines that ''Cloyne decide not to hold a meeting''

This is yet another blatant and reprehensible attempt by Frank and his small band of extremist supporters to deny democracy.

Cork is proud is its title 'The Rebel County' - we have always stood for decency and democracy.

Frank - Be there on the 8th March and we will deliver our message once again in a clear and dignified manner.

the rules on SGM's are quite clear in the Club Constitution.
All this shows is that the Cloyne commitee were naive in not reading those rules clearly. It's no biggy, once they adhere to the rules and the SGM is called correctly, then they can discuss the situation like grown men and if the need arises, vote on the motions presented. Then, because it is a democratic decision, they can all accept it, and get back to concentrating on the day to day business of Cloyne GAA.

[mirps]

I don't want to be naming guys, it's a small club!

A long way from btown though, so it was a surprise to us.

You're hardly Bugsy who plays with Killeagh are you?

No matter, just saw you said a football club...

[bugsy]

The issue with the notice of the SGM being shorter tan 10 days is not that it invalidates decisions made at the SGM. It simply means that those present at the AGM can VOTE to ajourn the SGM on the basis of the notice being too short. refer to the club rules - it's pretty clear. See the actual rule:

"8.15 Failure to comply strictly with the time limits set out in this Constitution and Rules or the non receipt of Notice of a Meeting by any persons entitled to receive notice shall not invalidate the proceedings at that meeting, but shall entitle the majority of members present to seek and be granted an adjournment of the meeting to such date by which they would be given an adequate time to be furnished with and consider the contents of any relevant documentation."

Having said this, this appears to be a long struggle - if your SGM is next week rather than this week, it'll still get the point across as to what the members think.

So essentially all he could do was propose a vote to adjourn the meeting?

[peopleluas]

So essentially all he could do was propose a vote to adjourn the meeting?

Precisely.

[bugsy]

Precisely.

Cheers for that

[peopleluas]

Cheers for that

Let's be fair at all times though. I'm personally 100% with the players. However, if somebody proposes a motion that the SGM notice is too short, and you believe that the shortness of the notice has likely affected attendance in such a way as to affect the result, then I would suggest that you second the motion and vote for it - making it clear why you are doing so of course.

It's no good if we prevail in this struggle through unfair means of using rules. Over and above rules, the process has to be fair, and be seen to be fair.

I'm certainly not questioning your fairness. I mention this just in case there might be some other readers here baited into unfair rule-duelling with the opposition - it's the very problem we are trying to overcome.

[peopleluas]

Let's be fair at all times though. I'm personally 100% with the players. However, if somebody proposes a motion that the SGM notice is too short, and you believe that the shortness of the notice has likely affected attendance in such a way as to affect the result, then I would suggest that you second the motion and vote for it - making it clear why you are doing so of course.

It's no good if we prevail in this struggle through unfair means of using rules. Over and above rules, the process has to be fair, and be seen to be fair.

I'm certainly not questioning your fairness. I mention this just in case there might be some other readers here baited into unfair rule-duelling with the opposition - it's the very problem we are trying to overcome.

Of course I hasten to add that if you believe that the there's absolutely no substance to the arguement that the shortness of the notice will impact the voting outcome, then of course oppose the adjournemt motion - but in this case, I'd strongly suggest explaining this, so it's clear that you are above all endeavoring to be fair.

[bugsy]

Of course I hasten to add that if you believe that the there's absolutely no substance to the arguement that the shortness of the notice will impact the voting outcome, then of course oppose the adjournemt motion - but in this case, I'd strongly suggest explaining this, so it's clear that you are above all endeavoring to be fair.

Yep, agree with everything you say. In our case it's easy enough to notify everyone due to having such a small membership. The arguement was everyone should have been notified in writing but that's nitpicking I would think.

[Rebelred]

very sensible points peopleluas.

c'mere, does anybody have a copy of the Cork County Bye-laws to hand anywhere?

[KolaKubes]

Bishopstown have done the very same re their meeting! This I presume is due to member Bob Honahan. People like Bob are the "sickness in Cork GAA" that John Gardiner spoke about a while back!

Sickness is a good word for it.

It's the same thinking that would rather the churches be 20% full with the right sort of unthinking simpies that know their place and follow whatever they're told rather than make an attempt to keep the sensible majority half way interested in religion.