Munster V Clermont

[Brad]

http://www.munsterrugby.ie/19_8704.php

Clermont Return
A Sell Out
8 December 2008, 10:51 am
By Pat Geraghty

The crucially important return game with ASM Clermont in Thomond Park next Saturday is a sell out and there will be no tickets on sale for the game.
Thomond Park will be packed to its 26,000 capacity for a second time in less than a month and Munster officials and players will be hoping that the packed stadium will generate the same atmosphere as it did on the night of the All Blacks game as Munster strive to maintain their interest in this year's competition.
Chief Executive Garrett Fitzgerald believes that Munster's renowned 16th man, the Thomond Park crowd, will need to be in full voice as never before. "Effectively, given the competitiveness of this group, there will be just one team emerging. So we need to win each of our next three games and the game against Clermont on Saturday will set the tone. The players themselves recognise the importance of the crowd and we believe that with the crowd in full voice the players will not be found wanting."

Munster lie in second place in the table one point behind Sale Sharks - who will be expected to come away from Montauban with maximum points next weekend - and just one point ahead of Clermont Auvergne

[kevinbitzz]

i think a 2-2 draw is on the cards

[Mick Lyons]

Here's a picture of Munsters renowned 16th man.

http://www.memoriespictures .co.uk/socialhistory/london%20life/Chimney%20Sweep%20LL 39.jpg

[Alan Smith]

Fuck it, the town of North Cork will have a good bit of extra traffic on them so :/
bite it

[Brad]

Good news for Munster - Rougerie and Domingo are out of Saturdays game - delighted.

[Redshirter]

Which Clermont team are we going to see in Thomond Park on saturday their best team or not ?

[Eoin]

Good news for Munster - Rougerie and Domingo are out of Saturdays game - delighted.

Rougerie is a big loss for them, he had a great game on sunday.

[Brad]

Rougerie is a big loss for them, he had a great game on sunday.

Yeah - even though a winger Rougerie is one of the main men at Clermont. Hopefully a few more of the lads below will not be able to make it.

From the CA webssite:
Definately out:
Fabien Alexandre (plantar fascia)
Thomas Domingo (sprained acromio clavicular)
Aurelien Rougerie (temporomandibular joint trauma mendibulaire)

Uncertain for the next match in Munster:
Gonzalo Canale (check biceps)
Alexandre Lapandry (calf stand)
Julien Bonnaire (calf stand)
Julien Pierre (slightly sprained acromio-clavicular)

[raZor]

Spare me your medical mumbo jumbo doc.

[liam2me]

anyone thing fogarty should start ahead of sheehan if flannery is still out?

[Redshirter]

anyone thing fogarty should start ahead of sheehan if flannery is still out?

I would start Frankie and when he begins to run out of steam replace him with Fogarty

[liam2me]

frankie wasn't great the last day, lost a few line outs and a scrum against the head, fogarty looked more assured when he came on

[Redshirter]

frankie wasn't great the last day, lost a few line outs and a scrum against the head, fogarty looked more assured when he came on

Agreed but Frankie does a lot of work that goes unseen

[HappyMonday83]

Agreed but Frankie does a lot of work that goes unseen

Like buying houses.

[Langer Dan]

Like buying houses.

heh heh heh.

.
Frankie is awesome at the markdown.......

[HappyMonday83]

heh heh heh.

.
Frankie is awesome at the markdown.......

Excellent.

[liam2me]

Agreed but Frankie does a lot of work that goes unseen
the easterbunny excuse. nope, i don't buy that at all.

looking long term as well, fogarty is 25, frankie is 32.


on a seperate issue, was looking at the player profiles, would ya not think they could have waited and taken the picture for this one (http://www.munsterrugby.ie/8330_8333.php?player =5023&includeref=dynamic) a few days later???

[HappyMonday83]

the easterbunny excuse. nope, i don't buy that at all.

looking long term as well, fogarty is 25, frankie is 32.


on a seperate issue, was looking at the player profiles, would ya not think they could have waited and taken the picture for this one (http://www.munsterrugby.ie/8330_8333.php?player =5023&includeref=dynamic) a few days later???

Looks like dougie hakaed him within an inch of his life.

[Coogee]

frankie wasn't great the last day, lost a few line outs and a scrum against the head, fogarty looked more assured when he came on

Dont rate fogarty at all..no physical presence at all for a hooker and his lineouts and scrummaging are no better than Sheehan...Start sheehan and bring on fogarty when frankie runs out of steam after 55-60 mins

[Mick Lyons]

A lot of professional rugby players seem to run out of steam after 60 mins.
What the fuck do they do at training all week?

[cantankerous bastard]

Yeah - even though a winger Rougerie is one of the main men at Clermont. Hopefully a few more of the lads below will not be able to make it.

From the CA webssite:
Definately out:
Fabien Alexandre (plantar fascia)
Thomas Domingo (sprained acromio clavicular)
Aurelien Rougerie (temporomandibular joint trauma mendibulaire)

Uncertain for the next match in Munster:
Gonzalo Canale (check biceps)
Alexandre Lapandry (calf stand)
Julien Bonnaire (calf stand)
Julien Pierre (slightly sprained acromio-clavicular)
Dont be such a dick, you dont wish injuries on another team, we should aim to beat them regardless of who they send.

We can beat them, it'll be another big ask at thomond but its certainly doable

[HappyMonday83]

Dont be such a dick, you dont wish injuries on another team, we should aim to beat them regardless of who they send.

We can beat them, it'll be another big ask at thomond but its certainly doable

Brad has a history of wishing injury on opposition teams.

[Brad]

Rumour has it Clermont may actually be sending over a weakened squad - i wouldn't be surprised to be honest. They know realistically they are probably not going to get through group and i i doubt they can afford more injuries(which would probably happen due to another bruiser on Saturday). Tis only a rumour mind you but would be great if true.

[Brad]

Dont be such a dick, you dont wish injuries on another team, we should aim to beat them regardless of who they send.

We can beat them, it'll be another big ask at thomond but its certainly doable

Oh relax! I am not wishing them to break their legs, but if they happen to be out for a week of two then i wouldn't say no. It is only balancing things out considering we are missing Leamy, Tipoki and Flannery - 3 top class players there.

[Redshirter]

Rumour has it Clermont may actually be sending over a weakened squad - i wouldn't be surprised to be honest. They know realistically they are probably not going to get through group and i i doubt they can afford more injuries(which would probably happen due to another bruiser on Saturday). Tis only a rumour mind you but would be great if true.

I will be very supprised if they send over a strong team as they have only a very very slim chance of reaching the Quarters it is now a two horse race between Munster and Sale and Montauban will have a big say in which of the two goes through

[Brad]

I will be very supprised if they send over a strong team as they have only a very very slim chance of reaching the Quarters it is now a two horse race between Munster and Sale and Montauban will have a big say in which of the two goes through

That bonus point Munster got at the end killed them off.

They have Munster and Sale away - being logical about it i'd say they know they are out. Can't blame anyone but themselves by losing to Sale at home.

I don't think Montaubon will have much say but i don't think they will roll over and die at home either.

[Redshirter]

That bonus point Munster got at the end killed them off.

They have Munster and Sale away - being logical about it i'd say they know they are out. Can't blame anyone but themselves by losing to Sale at home.

I don't think Montaubon will have much say but i don't think they will roll over and die at home either.

No French team is going to lie down when playing at home Montauban are going to be no different they gave as good as they got to Clermont in their home game in the HC

[Redshirter]

What is going to be the Munster team for saturday ? i would make two changes to the team that played last sunday play Paul Warwick at full back and Keith Earls in the centre with Barry Murphy on the bench

[Coogee]

A lot of professional rugby players seem to run out of steam after 60 mins.
What the fuck do they do at training all week?

as do alot of sportsmen in other sports hence substitutions...in sheehans case he is 33-34 and in th elast year or two of his career so his fitness levels are not bound to be as good as 6-7 years ago...

[POL]

sending over the second team eh? for the greatest compeition in world rugby??? :lol!: do these jocks even read what they write?

[POL]

its hilarious the way the French teams beat the shit out of Munstershire when they feel like it, then take the piss out of them the following week by sending over the youth team

[ItIsYeah]

Dont be such a dick, you dont wish injuries on another team, we should aim to beat them regardless of who they send.

We can beat them, it'll be another big ask at thomond but its certainly doable

Lol, what a retard.

[marco 2005]

Oh relax! I am not wishing them to break their legs, but if they happen to be out for a week of two then i wouldn't say no. It is only balancing things out considering we are missing Leamy, Tipoki and Flannery - 3 top class players there.

ffs....you can't be thinking that way....

Just for this i hope Clermont's 2nd team rips the shit out of your boys.

[POL]

I've seen Flannery caught ROG style on a bebo page

[STEVIEG]

I've seen Flannery caught ROG style on a bebo page

Link that shit up

[Edmund Blackwater]

Flannery would have better taste than ROG, I'd imagine.

[POL]

Link that shit up
I would but I know the girl(s) involved, i have some morals you know

[POL]

Flannery would have better taste than ROG, I'd imagine.You would be 100% correct eddie old chum

[STEVIEG]

I would but I know the girl(s) involved, i have some morals you know

Bows

is Flannery from Cork or Limerick?

[Edmund Blackwater]

Time to go to def con 4.

PM?

[POL]

Bows

is Flannery from Cork or Limerick?
Born In galway as far as I know, this incident happened in a clare nightclub

[POL]

Time to go to def con 4.

PM?sorry lads, I'm a gentleman, I might mess around with paintshop and see what I can do tommorrow

[Edmund Blackwater]

sorry lads, I'm a gentleman, I might mess around with paintshop and see what I can do tommorrow
It's as much as we could have hoped for.

[STEVIEG]

http://i36.tinypic.com/bi8n7s.jpg

[Langer Dan]

The Jocks are gonna take one hell of a kicking, just in time for the weekend.

[ANVIL]

I've an awful feeling - and I take no joy in predicting this - that Munster are going to lose by the shortest of margins.
A drop goal or penalty to decide it.

[Mick Lyons]

What is it about rugby lads and their wandering hands?

http://www.ninjadude.com/images/prince-william-breast-grope.jpg

[liam2me]

The Jocks are gonna take one hell of a kicking, just in time for the weekend.
i still laugh at you WRT rugby, you pretend to be a rugby head at the KO stages of the HC, admit to getting your tickets from corpo only, take a bashing from true rugby fans, then switch sides to play with the anti-rugby nuts.

you flip-flop more then a fish out of water

[Arcadia]

its hilarious the way the French teams beat the shit out of Munstershire when they feel like it, then take the piss out of them the following week by sending over the youth team

Biarritz 2006 & Toulouse 2008 finals say otherwise.

C'mon POL you can do better than this.

[Brad]

ffs....you can't be thinking that way....

Just for this i hope Clermont's 2nd team rips the shit out of your boys.

Clermont will not beat Munster no matter what team they send over. Im going to be bold here and suggest Munster will beat them by 11 points.

[POL]

Clermont B will not beat Munster no matter what team they send over. Im going to be bold here and suggest Munster will beat them by 11 points.
fixed

[duffer31]

fixed


im having a wad on munster as well.not doing any other bet this weekend. all my 20 bets are compiled and being lumped on munster. no point or handicap. just a straight win....

[POL]

im having a wad on munster as well.not doing any other bet this weekend. all my 20 bets are compiled and being lumped on munster. no point or handicap. just a straight win....Yes indeed, another "ligindary" occasion in the offering at "Fortress Thommand", when the brave soldiers of Munstershire face their destiny against all the odds to try and turn last weeks result around against the Clemount youth team, they might even write a play about it!

[Arcadia]

Yes indeed, another "ligindary" occasion in the offering at "Fortress Thommand", when the brave soldiers of Munstershire face their destiny against all the odds to try and turn last weeks result around against the Clemount youth team, they might even write a play about it!

Thats more like it POLLY.

[Redshirter]

This is a must win game for Munster and win they will and also get a bonus point and take a big step to reaching the QF Munster to score 4 - 5 tries

[Arcadia]

This is a must win game for Munster and win they will and also get a bonus point and take a big step to reaching the QF Munster to score 4 - 5 tries

I'll take a win.

A BP is a massive ask with Tipoki & Leamy injured.

[Redshirter]

Bows

is Flannery from Cork or Limerick?

Heard some where that the Wallace brothers Richard , Paul and David are originaly from Cork true or false

[Redshirter]

I'll take a win.

A BP is a massive ask with Tipoki & Leamy injured.

Not really Sale got 5 points in Clermont why can we not do the same in Thomond it could also mean the difference between a home or away QF which could be crucial

[Arcadia]

Not really Sale got 5 points in Clermont why can we not do the same in Thomond it could also mean the difference between a home or away QF which could be crucial

Should have had 2 more tries last week if all went well.

Forecast is'nt great for the weekend which won't help also.

Pressure is really on Munster and hope they don't have a "Montauban" type game.

Should be up for this one though.

[BangorFeen]

Heard some where that the Wallace brothers Richard , Paul and David are originaly from Cork true or false
The two older Wallaces, Richard and Paul were both born in Cork but David arrived shortly after the family moved to Limerick

[Redshirter]

Should have had 2 more tries last week if all went well.

Forecast is'nt great for the weekend which won't help also.

Pressure is really on Munster and hope they don't have a "Montauban" type game.

Should be up for this one though.

''Pressure is really on Munster ''

That is good news for Munster because they always perform when the pressure is on as they did in their last two HC games and not perform when the pressure is not on as they did against Montauban

I can see Munster putting in a big performance in this one

[BangorFeen]

Should have had 2 more tries last week if all went well.

Forecast is'nt great for the weekend which won't help also.

Pressure is really on Munster and hope they don't have a "Montauban" type game.

Should be up for this one though.
South terrace...

Nice and Exposed. I think I'll get in early and stand up the back

[Rebelred]

If Brock James gets one on one V ROG again, could spell trouble for the Limerick lads

[Redshirter]

If Brock James gets one on one V ROG again, could spell trouble for the Limerick lads

So one phase of play could decide the outcome of the game i doubt it very much

[Brad]

GOOD NEWS.Just heard Mick Galway on the news and he said the Munster players are very pissed off with the Clermont players. Apparently the Clermont players were slagging the Munster players big time after they won last Sunday. I was thrilled to hear that.

I am changing my prediction to a 13 point victory for Munster.

[Brad]

Munster: K Earls; D Howlett, B Murphy, L Mafi, I Dowling; R O'Gara, T O'Leary; M Horan, J Flannery, J Hayes; D O'Callaghan, P O'Connell capt; A Quinlan, N Ronan, D Wallace.

Replacements: D Fogarty, T Buckley, D Ryan, J Coughlan, P Stringer, P Warwick, K Lewis.



Bit harsh on Frankie to go out of the 22.

[Redshirter]

There is no room for error in this Munster setup Frankie has payed the price for some poor throwing into the lineout and the strike against the head by Clermont last sunday

[Brad]

There is no room for error in this Munster setup Frankie has payed the price for some poor throwing into the lineout and the strike against the head by Clermont last sunday

I know but lineout has not being great all year in all fariness.

Fuck me im feeling super confident. Hearing Mick Galway bitch about the Cermont lads has done me the world of good.

[STEVIEG]

S.

Nice and Exposed.

Careful with the wording BF!

[Brad]

Clermont: 15 Anthony Floch, 14 Julien Malzieu, 13 Marius Joubert, 12 Benoit Baby, 11 Napoliani Nalaga, 10 Brock James, 9 Pierre Mignoni, 8 Elvis Vermeulen (c), 7 Alexandre Audebert, 6 Julien Bonnaire, 5 Thibault Privat, 4 Jamie Cudmore, 3 Jacobus Roux, 2 Benoit Cabello, 1 Laurent Emmanuelli

Remplacements: 16 Mario Ledesma, 17 Davit Zirakashvili, 18 Christophe Samson, 19 Emmanuel Etien, 20 John Senio, 21 Seremaia Baï, 22 Grant Esterhuizen

Fijian flyer Napoliani Nalaga makes his return to the Clermont wing for Saturday's Heineken Cup Pool One clash away to defending champions Munster.

There are eight personnel and two positional changes to the side that beat Munster in Clermont last week.

Nalaga has served his 22-day suspension for a high tackle on Jean-Baptiste Elissalde in the Test between France and the Pacific Islands and returns the Clermont's starting line-up in the place of club captain Aurelien Rougerie.

Elsewhere in the back-line, former Springbok Marius Joubert will play after outside centre after recovering from injury, relegating Seremaïa Baï to the bench and moving Benoit Baby to the number twelve jersey.

There are a host of changes to the pack where Alexandre Audebert and Elvis Vermeulen are added to the back row to partner Julien Bonnaire. Vermeulen will also captain the side.

There is an all-new tight five as Canadian Jamie Cudmore moves the second row to partner Thibault Privat. Pumas hooker Mario Ledesma is dropped to the bench in favour of Benoit Cabello.

[POL]

jesus, this is not even the b team

[Redshirter]

jesus, this is not even the b team

You must be joking this clermont team is well capable of giving Munster a very serious game and a good run for their money

[POL]

You must be joking this clermont team is well capable of giving Munster a very serious game and a good run for their money
Maybe ROG might a conversion in the 102th minutes to win by a point and it can enter the annals of miracle matches!

[Langer Dan]

It doesn't get much bigger than this!!!

8 Changes? FFS:)

[Redshirter]

It doesn't get much bigger than this!!!

8 Changes? FFS:)

FFS let me explain what a lot of the changes are about clermont started the game last Sunday with some of their best players on the bench and brought them on in the second half that is why they played better in the second half than the first they are starting the game tomorrow also the man who is replaceing on the wing Rougerie was the top try scorer in the French league last season

[raZor]

Felipe the Wizard showing the curse of POL is alive and well still!

[Coogee]

Felipe the Wizard showing the curse of POL is alive and well still!

the great one bottled it tonight in France...BOD proves yet again that he is finished...will struggle to make the Lions tour at this rate...In fairness he has over 80 caps and is playing international rugby since 1999 and along with that kind of milage and the injuries he has picked up he was bound to slow up..

[Brad]

the great one bottled it tonight in France...BOD proves yet again that he is finished...will struggle to make the Lions tour at this rate...In fairness he has over 80 caps and is playing international rugby since 1999 and along with that kind of milage and the injuries he has picked up he was bound to slow up..

Bottled it? Don't be so ridiculous. I hate that Leinster/BOD bashing. I am gutted they lost. The team lost but one can hardly blame BOD totally.

BOD is not the player he was and will never have the speed he used have. However for 2/3 years he was put simply the best player in the world. One of the best centres ever and a legend.

[Redshirter]

Bottled it? Don't be so ridiculous. I hate that Leinster/BOD bashing. I am gutted they lost. The team lost but one can hardly blame BOD totally.

BOD is not the player he was and will never have the speed he used have. However for 2/3 years he was put simply the best player in the world. One of the best centres ever and a legend.

Totaly agree BOD was simply the best meaning no direspct to Irish rugby it was a pity that he was not playing for a team like England , South Africa . Australia or New Zealand he would have been a superstar

[Coogee]

Bottled it? Don't be so ridiculous. I hate that Leinster/BOD bashing. I am gutted they lost. The team lost but one can hardly blame BOD totally.

BOD is not the player he was and will never have the speed he used have. However for 2/3 years he was put simply the best player in the world. One of the best centres ever and a legend.

im not leinster bashing...if munster dont win the hec i would hope leinster do...i watched the game tonight and leinster were poor and lacked leadership on the field...contepomi missed some very easy kicks which could have won them the game....as for BOD, he was the best 13 in the world form 2000 to 2005/2006 but his speed is gone and he is so injury prone now i fell he wont last another 2 years...it happens alot of th egreats especially the ones who start playing at a very young age...Christian Cullen was th ebest full back in the world form 96-2000 but was a shadow of that player from the age of 28 onwards......as i said Brad im not Leinster bashing just stating my opinion

[raZor]

Totaly agree BOD was simply the best meaning no direspct to Irish rugby it was a pity that he was not playing for a team like England , South Africa . Australia or New Zealand he would have been a superstar

Who's saying he wasn't a superstar, he was probably the best center in the world up until a few years back. It's interesting to note that good players come and go the whole time in the position of center, very few manage to stay at the top level of performance for a long time, but as they say form is temporary class is permanent, BOD def. has the class.

Leinster lacked leadership big time last night that's not a disrespect to BOD he could only do so much but there was no leadership in the forwards, the back row dissapeared in the 2nd half.

Has Contepomi been ill for a while? On Sky they pointed out he'd shifted at lot of weight and was looking quite slight.

[Redshirter]

Leinster have no chance of winning the Heineken Cup the very best they can hope for is a Semi Final place and that is very doubtfull

Leinster and their supporters were living in a fantassy world after they beat a very poor Wasps team in the RDS two months ago last night they came back to reality with a big bump

They and their supporters should sit back and watch Munster show them how it is done in Thomond Park today

[HappyMonday83]

Leinster have no chance of winning the Heineken Cup the very best they can hope for is a Semi Final place and that is very doubtfull

Leinster and their supporters were living in a fantassy world after they beat a very poor Wasps team in the RDS two months ago last night they came back to reality with a big bump

They and their supporters should sit back and watch Munster show them how it is done in Thomond Park today

http://www.loungelightmedia .com/images/smilies/worf.gif

[liam2me]

http://www.loungelightmedia .com/images/smilies/worf.gif
ahem.

the big difference between munster and leinster is that munster are a team who play for each other and have the mental ability to come through. leinster are individuals who are too busy worrying about themselves. which is a pity as i would love to have all 3 irish HEC teams firing. delighted to see ulster putting together a good run of results at last

[Brad]

im not leinster bashing...if munster dont win the hec i would hope leinster do...i watched the game tonight and leinster were poor and lacked leadership on the field...contepomi missed some very easy kicks which could have won them the game....as for BOD, he was the best 13 in the world form 2000 to 2005/2006 but his speed is gone and he is so injury prone now i fell he wont last another 2 years...it happens alot of th egreats especially the ones who start playing at a very young age...Christian Cullen was th ebest full back in the world form 96-2000 but was a shadow of that player from the age of 28 onwards......as i said Brad im not Leinster bashing just stating my opinion

Fair enough - i just think the criticism of Leinster can be harsh sometimes and i think they suffer harsh criticism as they are constantly compared to Munster which is unfair. Munster are an exceptional team and over the last ten years have being the best team in Europe - everyone suffers in comparison to that.

Anyway i nearly has fucking heart failure today. That is 3 times we have played them properly and Clermont have battered us 3 times. I've never seen a team dominate Munster so much and 3 times in a row now(i still don't know how we won today). Clermont are an unreal team and i believe they have being the best team Munster have played in Europe over the last 2/3 years. Im not sure are Munster playing badly or are Clermont just that good. I don't know how we won today and i felt last year we should not have being within an asses roar of them, never mind poaching a bonus point. Again last week they battered Munster and we stole a bonus. I don't want to see them next year.

Lads, is the hunger still there? There seemed to be no intensity from the forwards today? Or was it just Clermont are that good.

We need Tipoki back big time.

Group is ours now - don't think Sale are going to get 5 points in Montaubon by the looks of things.

[Action Man]

Fair dues to ROG. 1000 points in HC rugby. Fucking legend.

[Brad]

Fair dues to ROG. 1000 points in HC rugby. Fucking legend.

His goalkicking was poor today but he made 12/13 tackles - fair play to him. Stats like that will help his Lions bid. A fucking pussy but he put his body on the line today and you can't ask for more than that.

[Action Man]

His goalkicking was poor today but he made 12/13 tackles - fair play to him. Stats like that will help his Lions bid. A fucking pussy but he put his body on the line today and you can't ask for more than that.

Ya he had a bad day kicking alright but we'll forgive him for that. He made some big tackels alright during the game. Not the greatest for the tackles but he played his part today.

[Carmona]

I thought the Clermont pack was playing much more as a unit, going for rucks and picking and carrying with 6/7 players, whereas Munster were attacking and defending in 2s and 3s. Unreal result for Munster, unreal performance from Clermont.

[Arcadia]

Munster played poorly and still won

Had zero posession in second half and sneaked 2 tries.

Tipoki & Leamy badly missed and should give Munster a boost next year.

Written off at 72 minutes and oulled it out of the fire - typical Munster.

Montauban leading Sale 16 -12 at half time

[Arcadia]

ahem.

the big difference between munster and leinster is that munster are a team who play for each other and have the mental ability to come through. leinster are individuals who are too busy worrying about themselves. which is a pity as i would love to have all 3 irish HEC teams firing. delighted to see ulster putting together a good run of results at last

Watched that game and very dissapointed for Leinster.

Contemponi messed up a basic restart in the second half it was all over.

[cit_gym_rat]

Munster played poorly and still won

Had zero posession in second half and sneaked 2 tries.

Tipoki & Leamy badly missed and should give Munster a boost next year.

Written off at 72 minutes and oulled it out of the fire - typical Munster.

Montauban leading Sale 16 -12 at half time


montauban win 16-12 were 10-6 up at half time

[Arcadia]

montauban win 16-12 were 10-6 up at half time

Sale got losing BP - Munster had better be up for that away game.

Great day for Munster overall.

[captainshamrock]

Fair dues to ROG. 1000 points in HC rugby. Fucking legend.

Hopefully we won't have to wait another 1000 points to see him put in a few tackles.
Good performance by most players. Wallace was a star as usual. Would like to see Warrick at full back and Earls at 13 until Tipoki is back.
I really hope we don't get Clermont in a group again. They are a fabulous team and I would love to see them win it. They play some great rugby and it would only be a good thing if they win it.
I'm not cheering for Leinster any more. They are gutless losers. BOD's penalty atempt for touch was one of the funnier things I saw this week.
They need to put Kearney at fullback. He's solid under the high ball and has a serious kick and makes ground every time he runs. Kidney isn't going to put him in at FB unless Leinster do it first and we need him there.

[Eoin]

Sale got losing BP - Munster had better be up for that away game.

Great day for Munster overall.

Munster have Sale at home next up, if they win that then the montauban result in hte last round is immaterial.

Was at the game today, jesus christ what a finish. Feel bad for Clermont, they were by far the better team and probably deserved to win.

Just goes to show you can never write off Munster.

Few lads a few rows ahead of me left with 5 minutes to go, muppets.

[Brad]

Munster have Sale at home next up, if they win that then the montauban result in hte last round is immaterial.

Was at the game today, jesus christ what a finish. Feel bad for Clermont, they were by far the better team and probably deserved to win.

Just goes to show you can never write off Munster.

Few lads a few rows ahead of me left with 5 minutes to go, muppets.

Would ya blame them?!We've all seen munster come back from no where but today took the biscuit altogether.

I'd have to agree with George Hook - Munster have knocked out the best, most complete team in Europe. Clermont are hands down the best team i've seen over the last 2/3 years.

[LawrenceSummers]

Hopefully we won't have to wait another 1000 points to see him put in a few tackles.
Good performance by most players. Wallace was a star as usual. Would like to see Warrick at full back and Earls at 13 until Tipoki is back.
I really hope we don't get Clermont in a group again. They are a fabulous team and I would love to see them win it. They play some great rugby and it would only be a good thing if they win it.
I'm not cheering for Leinster any more. They are gutless losers. BOD's penalty atempt for touch was one of the funnier things I saw this week.
They need to put Kearney at fullback. He's solid under the high ball and has a serious kick and makes ground every time he runs. Kidney isn't going to put him in at FB unless Leinster do it first and we need him there.

he made 46 tackles today and missed one, cop on, they were running his channel all day, and they were big dudes

[LawrenceSummers]

Would ya blame them?!We've all seen munster come back from no where but today took the biscuit altogether.

I'd have to agree with George Hook - Munster have knocked out the best, most complete team in Europe. Clermont are hands down the best team i've seen over the last 2/3 years.

who have, hands down not won a fucking thing....... teams need to be more than the sum of their parts. munster are more than the sum of their parts, leinster are less and clermont are only as good as they want to be, not as good as they need to be.

they have the players, money, supporters, facilities but nothing to show for it

[LawrenceSummers]

Munster have Sale at home next up, if they win that then the montauban result in hte last round is immaterial.

Was at the game today, jesus christ what a finish. Feel bad for Clermont, they were by far the better team and probably deserved to win.

Just goes to show you can never write off Munster.

Few lads a few rows ahead of me left with 5 minutes to go, muppets.


not its not, we have to win both games to qualify, if we beat sale and loose to mont then clermont can still win the group if they win both games

its simple, win both games, nothing more, nothing less no hassle or need for bonus points, and other teams getting bonus points doesnt matter

[Mick Lyons]

Rog is a fucking windbag.

[ANVIL]

Hopefully we won't have to wait another 1000 points to see him put in a few tackles.
Good performance by most players. Wallace was a star as usual. Would like to see Warrick at full back and Earls at 13 until Tipoki is back.
I really hope we don't get Clermont in a group again. They are a fabulous team and I would love to see them win it. They play some great rugby and it would only be a good thing if they win it.
I'm not cheering for Leinster any more. They are gutless losers. BOD's penalty atempt for touch was one of the funnier things I saw this week.
They need to put Kearney at fullback. He's solid under the high ball and has a serious kick and makes ground every time he runs. Kidney isn't going to put him in at FB unless Leinster do it first and we need him there.

I think you must have been watching a different game - O'Gara tackled superbly and, save for missing some simple kicks that you can only really put down to pre-1000 nerves, had a great game.
Of course he has some duff days - more so lately - but you'd have to have a parsimonious personality not to congratulate a player for such a magnificent achievement.
Mind you Munster made hard work of beating 14 men.

[Carmona]

Rog is a fucking windbag.

Willya look at Mick, the big talking lad. This post would be funny if it wasn't pathetic. It's got "I hope Lamps reads this, cos he'll then congratulate me which'll be the signal for Happy and Backwater and POL - if he hasn't lost too much on the gee gees - to jump on board in that GHEY SFI thingy".

[bigboyfoolish]

Great scrap yesterday lads.. Unreal to see 2 genuine heavyweights go at it..

That lad Cudmore well able to throw a few haymakers..

[Eoin]

not its not, we have to win both games to qualify, if we beat sale and loose to mont then clermont can still win the group if they win both games


yeah, thats true I suppose. If Clermont don't get the bonus point against Montauban though, and Munster beat Sale, then Munster are safe as it means the max clermont can get is 17 points. If the sides finish level then Munster go through on head to heads cos they've scored more tries in the 2 games between them.

[Proinsias]

Great scrap yesterday lads.. Unreal to see 2 genuine heavyweights go at it..

That lad Cudmore well able to throw a few haymakers..

True, although he cracked POC with a nice one first, O'Connell was still was good enough to look at the linesman with a "Hey, look, this guy is punching me" look on his face. Until he hit him again and O'Connell decides to fight back.


I think O'Connell won that one, he got in a good few digs on the ground. Should have just left it with the one sweet shot.

[Proinsias]

Would ya blame them?!We've all seen munster come back from no where but today took the biscuit altogether.

I'd have to agree with George Hook - Munster have knocked out the best, most complete team in Europe. Clermont are hands down the best team i've seen over the last 2/3 years.
Bloody good team alright.
who have, hands down not won a fucking thing....... teams need to be more than the sum of their parts. munster are more than the sum of their parts, leinster are less and clermont are only as good as they want to be, not as good as they need to be.

they have the players, money, supporters, facilities but nothing to show for it

They finished top of the table in the Top 14 in france last year. In my book, that makes them the league winners, regardless of what some stupid cash-generating mini cup decides.

Their backline was brilliant, at times it was like men against boys, although I'm glad Rougerie missed the match. O'Leary's tackle on Baby was very beneficial for Munster too, he's an excellent player, was having a good game too.

[raZor]

Horan, 2 tries from the wing in 2 games, he'll never be moved from there now! ;)

I had my doubts about Ronan but he looks like he gets better with every game took the try very well.

[raZor]

Bloody good team alright.


They finished top of the table in the Top 14 in france last year. In my book, that makes them the league winners, regardless of what some stupid cash-generating mini cup decides.

Their backline was brilliant, at times it was like men against boys, although I'm glad Rougerie missed the match. O'Leary's tackle on Baby was very beneficial for Munster too, he's an excellent player, was having a good game too.

That was a fantastic tackle, Baby's line was excellent and took a hug hit to stop him, looked like it rung his bell pretty bad.

[Mick Lyons]

Willya look at Mick, the big talking lad. This post would be funny if it wasn't pathetic. It's got "I hope Lamps reads this, cos he'll then congratulate me which'll be the signal for Happy and Backwater and POL - if he hasn't lost too much on the gee gees - to jump on board in that GHEY SFI thingy".

I stand by everything I post.
If people agree with me fine.
If they don't, that's their loss.
I see the media wankfest is in full flow today.
Another epic chapter in the great big book of Munster legends.:rolleyes:

[Coogee]

I stand by everything I post.
If people agree with me fine.
If they don't, that's their loss.
I see the media wankfest is in full flow today.
Another epic chapter in the great big book of Munster legends.:rolleyes:

pretty easy to do that on a message board where no one knows who you are.....and as for the media they couldnt have a wankfest over munster if they didnt consistently prodcue big results for the last 8-10 years....

[Carmona]

pretty easy to do that on a message board where no one knows who you are.....and as for the media they couldnt have a wankfest over munster if they didnt consistently prodcue big results for the last 8-10 years....

But, don't ya see, that's the bit that irks the boys? They hate success!!!

[cit_gym_rat]

That was a fantastic tackle, Baby's line was excellent and took a hug hit to stop him, looked like it rung his bell pretty bad.
it was a try saver

[Langer Dan]

Munster have Sale at home next up, if they win that then the montauban result in hte last round is immaterial.

Was at the game today, jesus christ what a finish. Feel bad for Clermont, they were by far the better team and probably deserved to win.

Just goes to show you can never write off Munster.


Horan should have been wearing a mask with that late try.:p
I'v never seen a side own the ball so much and come away without the win.
Munster were absolute cat in the second half, they deserved a whalloping going on the posession stakes but you have to take your chances and Clermont left themselves open to just such a finish through their squnadering of try opportunities on the Munster line.

Very exciting finish but I'd worry for Munster if they deliver mant more lacklustre third quarter displays like yesterdays.

I mean the try was their first meaningful attack inside the Clermont 22 in the 2nd half.

A great result but a very, very fortunate one.

[Mick Lyons]

pretty easy to do that on a message board where no one knows who you are.....and as for the media they couldnt have a wankfest over munster if they didnt consistently prodcue big results for the last 8-10 years....

Welcome to the internet my friend, how can I help you?

[Coogee]

Welcome to the internet my friend, how can I help you?

so why do you think the media are heaping praise on munster then....uit be the same reason they do over the like on Man U, Brazil etc and other successful teams...

[Eoin]

so why do you think the media are heaping praise on munster then....uit be the same reason they do over the like on Man U, Brazil etc and other successful teams...

Its an anti-gaa conspiracy perpetrated by the pro-jock media.

[Mick Lyons]

I was talking to a girl at the christmas party friday night. She told me she was from Galway and the subject of sport came up so I asked her how she thought the hurlers would do next year now Ger was gone. She said she didn't know much about the GAA (fair enough) but she was a huge rugby fan.
I asked her (somewhat naively), "Would you go to see Connacht play much?"
She paused for a minute as if trying to make sense of what I had just said and replied, "No.................. ..... I support Munster."
I half got the impression she didn't know Connacht even had a team.
There's plenty more like her out there too.

[bugsy]

I was talking to a girl at the christmas party friday night. She told me she was from Galway and the subject of sport came up so I asked her how she thought the hurlers would do next year now Ger was gone. She said she didn't know much about the GAA (fair enough) but she was a huge rugby fan.
I asked her (somewhat naively), "Would you go to see Connacht play much?"
She paused for a minute as if trying to make sense of what I had just said and replied, "No.................. ..... I support Munchester Utd."
I half got the impression she didn't know Connacht even had a team.
There's plenty more like her out there too.

Basically what she may as well have said

[liam2me]

Horan should have been wearing a mask with that late try.:p
I'v never seen a side own the ball so much and come away without the win.
Munster were absolute cat in the second half, they deserved a whalloping going on the posession stakes but you have to take your chances and Clermont left themselves open to just such a finish through their squnadering of try opportunities on the Munster line.

Very exciting finish but I'd worry for Munster if they deliver mant more lacklustre third quarter displays like yesterdays.

I mean the try was their first meaningful attack inside the Clermont 22 in the 2nd half.

A great result but a very, very fortunate one.
ahh, so you've decided to put your pro-munster mask back on. you're worse then a fish out of water. arse licking POL and co when it suits ya, and then ditching them when things go against them in their patty little game. sad

[shamoverhere]

I half got the impression she didn't know Connacht even had a team.
There's plenty more like her out there too.

that's probably true. But whose fault exactly is that? The Munster team? hardly. The IRFU, certainly culpable. The media? for sure. Demographics? also a factor.

[duffer31]

Haunted.....

[Brad]

yeah, thats true I suppose. If Clermont don't get the bonus point against Montauban though, and Munster beat Sale, then Munster are safe as it means the max clermont can get is 17 points. If the sides finish level then Munster go through on head to heads cos they've scored more tries in the 2 games between them.


I think i am right in saying if we got 5 points against Sale then we win the group, no matter what anyone else does.

Am i right in saying this folks?

[Eoin]

I think i am right in saying if we got 5 points against Sale then we win the group, no matter what anyone else does.

Am i right in saying this folks?

Yes.

Then, even if Clermont get 2 bonus point victories in their last 2 games, they can only draw level on points if Munster lose to Montauban. Since Munster scored a losing bonus point and more tries in the 2 games against Clermont they go through top of the group.

[Brad]

Yes.

Then, even if Clermont get 2 bonus point victories in their last 2 games, they can only draw level on points if Munster lose to Montauban. Since Munster scored a losing bonus point and more tries in the 2 games against Clermont they go through top of the group.

As i thought - it would be great to wrap up the group then. Could do without heading to Montaubon needing points. The home draw is well gone now.

[Redshirter]

As i thought - it would be great to wrap up the group then. Could do without heading to Montaubon needing points. The home draw is well gone now.

We still have a good chance of getting as home draw should we go through if we get 9 points from out last two games we have a fair chance if we get 10 points we will probably have a home QF

[Eoin]

As i thought - it would be great to wrap up the group then. Could do without heading to Montaubon needing points. The home draw is well gone now.

I don't think its well gone, 2 bonus point wins would put Munster right back in with a chance I think.

[Proinsias]

Injustice seems to be the main thrust of this article...

http://www.lequipe.fr/Rugby/breves2008/20081213_182611_cler mont-a-frole-l-exploit.html

[Matlock]

Haunted.....

Absolutely!

Had lunch with a man from Clermont yesterday, felt fierce sorry for him. Travelling all that way to watch his side play better and still be beaten.

[captainshamrock]

I think you must have been watching a different game - O'Gara tackled superbly and, save for missing some simple kicks that you can only really put down to pre-1000 nerves, had a great game.
Of course he has some duff days - more so lately - but you'd have to have a parsimonious personality not to congratulate a player for such a magnificent achievement.
Mind you Munster made hard work of beating 14 men.

I'm actually saying he did do some decent tackles. I was just suprised. I turned to a mate and laughed when he made the first one as it was so unexpected. Usually it looks like you are throwing a live fish at the attacker. He flops around and bounces off.
Wouldn't slag him over a few missed kicks every now and then, thats one area he has improved over the years. Despite some stunning games over the years just can't stand him. Too inconsistent and unreliable and thats not recently, recently he's just poor.

Not sure if Munster made hard work of it or not. Clermont really are that good when they are on their game. I hope they win it next year.

[Redshirter]

I don't think its well gone, 2 bonus point wins would put Munster right back in with a chance I think.

23 points and we will have a home QF and it is still possible with 22 points

[HappyMonday83]

I think you must have been watching a different game - O'Gara tackled superbly and, save for missing some simple kicks that you can only really put down to pre-1000 nerves, had a great game.
Of course he has some duff days - more so lately - but you'd have to have a parsimonious personality not to congratulate a player for such a magnificent achievement.
Mind you Munster made hard work of beating 14 men.

What fucking game were you watching lad?

His kicking out of hand was loose to say the least. He missed his kicks at goal. A number of fellas ran over him during the match and he completly failed to get his back-line moving. James played him off the park, of that there is no doubt. If there is one thing to be learned form the past two games it's that clermont are a much better team than munster.

[Eoin]

23 points and we will have a home QF and it is still possible with 22 points

Not necessarily. At the moment, Munster have the lowest points total of any of the group leaders. 2 less than the nearest.

Even 23 points might not be enough to put them in the top 4 winners.

[Brad]

What fucking game were you watching lad?

His kicking out of hand was loose to say the least. He missed his kicks at goal. A number of fellas ran over him during the match and he completly failed to get his back-line moving. James played him off the park, of that there is no doubt. If there is one thing to be learned form the past two games it's that clermont are a much better team than munster.

:lol!:

Can i nominate that for most stupid comment of the year? Thanks guys.

[Brad]

I don't think its well gone, 2 bonus point wins would put Munster right back in with a chance I think.

I don't think we will get 10 points from remaining two games. I am just looking at the groups and even if we got 23 it still would be doubtful. Just as long as they avoid Toulouse away they will be fine.

A trip to Cardiff or Lecicester would be nice.

[Arcadia]

What fucking game were you watching lad?

His kicking out of hand was loose to say the least. He missed his kicks at goal. A number of fellas ran over him during the match and he completly failed to get his back-line moving. James played him off the park, of that there is no doubt. If there is one thing to be learned form the past two games it's that clermont are a much better team than munster.

THEY HAVE it, the stuff of champions, and that's why they're the champions of Europe. Reflecting on "one of the toughest games I ever played in", Clermont's Australian outhalf, Brock James, deduced: "But that's what you expect in this tournament but particularly against Munster.

"It was the first time I played here and it was an amazing experience, something you don't get every week you play rugby. We were reduced to 14 men for almost 60 minutes and that made it a bit tougher.

"I was proud of our performance; it didn't surprise me that much because I feel we are a courageous as well as a talented team. We stepped up when the going got tough, stepped up and had a really good go."

James admitted things were looking good for Clermont until those last four minutes.

"Any team with the ability to soak up pressure as they did and then respond with a couple of tries and 12 points to win it has to be given credit; I guess that's what makes them the type of team that can win championships - they've got that winning habit and they can never be considered beaten until the final whistle goes," said James.

[HappyMonday83]

:lol!:

Can i nominate that for most stupid comment of the year? Thanks guys.

Coming from a racist, i'll take that as a complement.

[HappyMonday83]

THEY HAVE it, the stuff of champions, and that's why they're the champions of Europe. Reflecting on "one of the toughest games I ever played in", Clermont's Australian outhalf, Brock James, deduced: "But that's what you expect in this tournament but particularly against Munster.

"It was the first time I played here and it was an amazing experience, something you don't get every week you play rugby. We were reduced to 14 men for almost 60 minutes and that made it a bit tougher.

"I was proud of our performance; it didn't surprise me that much because I feel we are a courageous as well as a talented team. We stepped up when the going got tough, stepped up and had a really good go."

James admitted things were looking good for Clermont until those last four minutes.

"Any team with the ability to soak up pressure as they did and then respond with a couple of tries and 12 points to win it has to be given credit; I guess that's what makes them the type of team that can win championships - they've got that winning habit and they can never be considered beaten until the final whistle goes," said James.

A post match interview. What do you expect him to say?

Do you honestly think that's the type of stuff they were saying in the dressing room after the game? Serious question.

[Matlock]

A post match interview. What do you expect him to say?

Do you honestly think that's the type of stuff they were saying in the dressing room after the game? Serious question.

What do you think they were saying?

Serious question...

[Brad]

“We were staring down the barrel and thinking it might be all over or that things could be out of our control,” he admitted. “There is huge credit to the players. They showed tremendous belief and that’s our third win in the last five minutes this season. Some days, you’ve got to hang tough. Any time you play a side of that magnitude, you’re very happy to get a result. Clermont are the best I’ve ever analysed in my time at Munster. We’ve proven against Montauban, Llanelli and again today that this side of ours has full belief in what they are doing. They play right to the 80th minute and it takes a good side to get past them

Good quote from McGahan - have to agree. Clermont are without doubt the best Munster have played in last 2/3 years. Surprised they have not won the top 14 - they look a much better team than Toulouse/Stade Francais.

[Brad]

What do you think they were saying?

Serious question...

HM83 is a top class rugby player for mighty Charleville - he would know exactly what would be said the changing room.

[Arcadia]

A post match interview. What do you expect him to say?

Do you honestly think that's the type of stuff they were saying in the dressing room after the game? Serious question.

I can only go by what they actually said after the game and unless you know otherwise I am all ears.

Loss hard for Cotter to swallow

All smiles then. Tony McGahan and Vern Cotter were as cosy as twins in the corridor outside the dressing-rooms in Thomond Park yesterday evening, just as they had been before the kick-off.

It was as if what had happened in between didn't involve anything in the way of aggression between their players. Interestingly, the Clermont coach was far from distraught despite seeing his team backed into an impossible corner now, and in heart-breaking circumstances.

"I just don't think the players got a just reward after putting in pretty good footy for 60 odd minutes with one player down. We just needed to have one more possession and keep it and we probably could have sneaked away with a victory. Instead they got the ball back and scored. The second try was difficult to swallow to be honest but all in all it was a good arm wrestle. In fact it went past arm-wrestling at one stage and got into something else."

And did he think it fair that Jamie Cudmore walked all the way to the dressing room while Paul O'Connell stopped at the sin bin? "I thought the red card and yellow card was a fairly unbalanced decision but I'll have to have a look at the footage," he said.


In fairness to Cotter, there wasn't word of complaint from him. "We have to look at the positive side of that game," Cotter said. "These type of events against teams like Munster help teams grow."

[Eoin]

Good quote from McGahan - have to agree. Clermont are without doubt the best Munster have played in last 2/3 years. Surprised they have not won the top 14 - they look a much better team than Toulouse/Stade Francais.

Well they topped the table last year. They've lost something like 7 finals.

Definitely the best team I've seen recently.

[HappyMonday83]

What do you think they were saying?

Serious question...

They were F'ing and jeffing about how they got absolutely robbed by both munster and the ref. O'Connell deserved a red as much as Cudmore did. The ref bottled it.

[HappyMonday83]

I can only go by what they actually said after the game and unless you know otherwise I am all ears.

Loss hard for Cotter to swallow

All smiles then.

Answer the question ArcY. I didn't ask you what you know, I'm asking you what you think.

Do you actually think that away from the press that the clermont lads were talking like that?

[Arcadia]

They were F'ing and jeffing about how they got absolutely robbed by both munster and the ref. O'Connell deserved a red as much as Cudmore did. The ref bottled it.

You have not got a clue what they said in the dressing room so stop faffing about

The ref was poor for both teams - Clermont pulling down Munster players in the maul by the legs a few times went unpunished.


Save your rubbish for Leinster who actually bottled it at the weekend.

[HappyMonday83]

You have not got a clue what they said in the dressing room so stop faffing about

The ref was poor for both teams - Clermont pulling down Munster players in the maul by the legs a few times went unpunished.


Save your rubbish for Leinster who actually bottled it at the weekend.

Anyone who has ever played a team sport knows exactly what clermont were feeling after the final whistle.

[Matlock]

I can only go by what they actually said after the game and unless you know otherwise I am all ears.

Loss hard for Cotter to swallow

All smiles then. Tony McGahan and Vern Cotter were as cosy as twins in the corridor outside the dressing-rooms in Thomond Park yesterday evening, just as they had been before the kick-off.

It was as if what had happened in between didn't involve anything in the way of aggression between their players. Interestingly, the Clermont coach was far from distraught despite seeing his team backed into an impossible corner now, and in heart-breaking circumstances.

"I just don't think the players got a just reward after putting in pretty good footy for 60 odd minutes with one player down. We just needed to have one more possession and keep it and we probably could have sneaked away with a victory. Instead they got the ball back and scored. The second try was difficult to swallow to be honest but all in all it was a good arm wrestle. In fact it went past arm-wrestling at one stage and got into something else."

And did he think it fair that Jamie Cudmore walked all the way to the dressing room while Paul O'Connell stopped at the sin bin? "I thought the red card and yellow card was a fairly unbalanced decision but I'll have to have a look at the footage," he said.


In fairness to Cotter, there wasn't word of complaint from him. "We have to look at the positive side of that game," Cotter said. "These type of events against teams like Munster help teams grow."

O Connell tried to get the linesmans attention in relation to Cudmore walloping him and Cudmore just kept going.

[Arcadia]

Answer the question ArcY. I didn't ask you what you know, I'm asking you what you think.

Do you actually think that away from the press that the clermont lads were talking like that?

I can only go by what they actually said but I have a hunch that they ( and I don't know where I get it from) that they may be dissapointed.

Just a hunch.

Games are won on the pitch so post match dressing room tears of woe and comments don't butter any parsnips.

[Arcadia]

O Connell tried to get the linesmans attention in relation to Cudmore walloping him and Cudmore just kept going.

And he trew a few punches at DOC also which was the final straw.

[Arcadia]

Anyone who has ever played a team sport knows exactly what clermont were feeling after the final whistle.

Team loses ?

Pissed off ?

Just a wild guess.

Do I win a prize ?

[johnmcork]

i thought the ref called it exactly right with the cards.

a scary night at thomond. i was in the east terrace by the corner flag where horan scored. spent the whole second half straining to see a game that was exclusively at the other end of the pitch before it came to our corner in dramatic style. huge relief when they turned it around. whatever else you boys say about munster, you can't deny that they are never without serious drama. great result

[captainshamrock]

If you asked anyone who knew what they were talking about before the draw Clermont were the team we most wanted to avoid. They are a superb team and if they didn't missfire against Sale it would be a totally difference situation. They need to win the T14 to get the pressure off and then they will destroy most teams in the HC on the way to winning it.
Robbed by Munster, undoubtedly but thats what a great team does. They pulled a win out when it looked like they had no reason to. There was only a few points in it but they were living off defense.
Not robbed by the ref. If POC had got a red it would have been justifiable but harsh. If he hadn't reacted after the second round punches it would have been a further fagifying of rugby and he should have been taken off anyway. Reacting at this stage was at worst a yellow but once they went down the continuing to punch it could have been red. What saved him was he stood there and took a few punches waiting for the ref to intervene before he reacted. It was a fair enough call, certainly not a bottling by the ref.

[HappyMonday83]

I can only go by what they actually said but I have a hunch that they ( and I don't know where I get it from) that they may be dissapointed.

Just a hunch.

Games are won on the pitch so post match dressing room tears of woe and comments don't butter any parsnips.

If you've ever wondered why I treat you like idiot when it comes to rugby, there's your answer.

[johnmcork]

If you asked anyone who knew what they were talking about before the draw Clermont were the team we most wanted to avoid. They are a superb team and if they didn't missfire against Sale it would be a totally difference situation. They need to win the T14 to get the pressure off and then they will destroy most teams in the HC on the way to winning it.
Robbed by Munster, undoubtedly but thats what a great team does. They pulled a win out when it looked like they had no reason to. There was only a few points in it but they were living off defense.
Not robbed by the ref. If POC had got a red it would have been justifiable but harsh. If he hadn't reacted after the second round punches it would have been a further fagifying of rugby and he should have been taken off anyway. Reacting at this stage was at worst a yellow but once they went down the continuing to punch it could have been red. What saved him was he stood there and took a few punches waiting for the ref to intervene before he reacted. It was a fair enough call, certainly not a bottling by the ref.
i totally agree. what kind of message would o'connell have been sending out if he didn't react? the referees always take a harder line against the initial aggressor and rightly so. if he didn't defend himself they'd be saying that it was a cynical ploy to get your man sent off that betrays the fact that he has no bottle. clermont are a great team. this is a hugely difficult pool. it's a testament to the munster defence that they only conceded one try in a hugely difficult second half. fare play.

[Matlock]

If you've ever wondered why I treat you like idiot when it comes to rugby, there's your answer.

Why?

As far as i can see, your only argument is that you think that Clermont were robbed because Paul O Connell should have red carded as well. You are entitled to your opinion, i disagree with it but you are entitled to it.

Im not sure why you are throwing insults around just because your opinion is being disagreed with?

[Arcadia]

If you've ever wondered why I treat you like idiot when it comes to rugby, there's your answer.

I am hardly going to take you seriously now am I ?

I just use you for comedy value.

I talk rugby with real people.

[Proinsias]

O Connell tried to get the linesmans attention in relation to Cudmore walloping him and Cudmore just kept going.

Exactly.

Normally, for a punch or two, you'd get a yellow but he was hitting a man who clearly wasn't looking for a fight.


Incidentally, O'Gara put in a nice tackle on Cudmore very early on, put him on his arse in an almost dump tackle.

Cudmore has form:

http://uk.reuters.com/article/sportsNews/idUKL081944942008010 8


If they topped the table, they're french league winners in my book. They're a damned good side, no doubt about it.

[HappyMonday83]

Why?

As far as i can see, your only argument is that you think that Clermont were robbed because Paul O Connell should have red carded as well. You are entitled to your opinion, i disagree with it but you are entitled to it.

Im not sure why you are throwing insults around just because your opinion is being disagreed with?

That match was almost a dictionary definition of being robbed.

[Proinsias]

That match was almost a dictionary definition of being robbed.

Or bottling it in the last 4 minutes.

Both tries were completely legit. Where's the robbing?

[Arcadia]

Exactly.

Normally, for a punch or two, you'd get a yellow but he was hitting a man who clearly wasn't looking for a fight.


Incidentally, O'Gara put in a nice tackle on Cudmore very early on, put him on his arse in an almost dump tackle.

Cudmore has form:

http://uk.reuters.com/article/sportsNews/idUKL081944942008010 8


If they topped the table, they're french league winners in my book. They're a damned good side, no doubt about it.


Cudmore certainly cost them a very good chance of winning the game but there were only 2 lineouts ? in the second half they kept the ball in hand and did'nt kick to touch.Very strong side and anyone who says that the French clubs don't take this comp seriously got their answer.

[Brad]

i totally agree. what kind of message would o'connell have been sending out if he didn't react? the referees always take a harder line against the initial aggressor and rightly so. if he didn't defend himself they'd be saying that it was a cynical ploy to get your man sent off that betrays the fact that he has no bottle. clermont are a great team. this is a hugely difficult pool. it's a testament to the munster defence that they only conceded one try in a hugely difficult second half. fare play.

Exaclty - POC would have looked like a right pussy if he did not strike back - O Gara said in his book he is still being mocked to this day over not fighting back against Duncan McRae.

One try is all we have conceded? Christ that is some stat.

[HappyMonday83]

I am hardly going to take you seriously now am I ?

I just use you for comedy value.

I talk rugby with real people.

In fairness ArcY, you talk shite.

The sad part is that you are missing so much on account of your blinkered view.

[Brad]

Cudmore certainly cost them a very good chance of winning the game but there were only 2 lineouts ? in the second half they kept the ball in hand and did'nt kick to touch.Very strong side and anyone who says that the French clubs don't take this comp seriously got their answer.

Read that this morning - goof tactic from their coach. Word on the street is he didn't want us having many lineouts to get a good platform from.

[Matlock]

That match was almost a dictionary definition of being robbed.

I disagree. if Cudmore hadnt been sent off or if O Connell had been sent off it might have given Clermont a better chance of winning but they werent "robbed" imo. I would only use that phrase if a try was given when it clearly shouldnt have been or something like that. Otherwise any team could claim that they could have won "if" this that or the other happened.

[Arcadia]

In fairness ArcY, you talk shite.

The sad part is that you are missing so much on account of your blinkered view.

Ah HM83 going on about a blinkered view :rolleyes:

I've seen it all now.

It was worth it coming in here today for that alone.

[HappyMonday83]

Or bottling it in the last 4 minutes.

Both tries were completely legit. Where's the robbing?

Playing with 14 for most of the match was bound to catch up with them. For me the robbing was done with O' connell not getting red.

[HappyMonday83]

I disagree. if Cudmore hadnt been sent off or if O Connell had been sent off it might have given Clermont a better chance of winning but they werent "robbed" imo. I would only use that phrase if a try was given when it clearly shouldnt have been or something like that. Otherwise any team could claim that they could have won "if" this that or the other happened.

Being robbed is losing a match that was all but won.

[HappyMonday83]

Ah HM83 going on about a blinkered view :rolleyes:

I've seen it all now.

It was worth it coming in here today for that alone.

I'm a fan of the game ArcY. Not being a munstershire fanboy means that I don't have to pretend that up the jumper rugby is great to watch.

[Proinsias]

Playing with 14 for most of the match was bound to catch up with them. For me the robbing was done with O' connell not getting red.


bQsermgwdfw

It's spot on. Cudmore gave DOC a few smacks after the ref had broken it up, literally inches from the linesman.

You're a coward if you punch someone that's not looking.

Tis alright to have a bit of a punch up, a yellow card is fair enough but Cudmore went too far, he was a liability out there.

O'Connell was defending himself.

[Proinsias]

I'm a fan of the game ArcY. Not being a munstershire fanboy means that I don't have to pretend that up the jumper rugby is great to watch.

So playing 20 phases in a row, was it Clermont playing the beautiful rugby?

[Arcadia]

I'm a fan of the game ArcY. Not being a munstershire fanboy means that I don't have to pretend that up the jumper rugby is great to watch.

Since the ELV's where have Munster been playing "Up the jumper rugby" ?

[HappyMonday83]

bQsermgwdfw

It's spot on. Cudmore gave DOC a few smacks after the ref had broken it up, literally inches from the linesman.

You're a coward if you punch someone that's not looking.

Tis alright to have a bit of a punch up, a yellow card is fair enough but Cudmore went too far, he was a liability out there.

O'Connell was defending himself.

I agree 100% with everything you said except that bit. Punching someone who's not looking makes you a scumbag in my book and he deserves to get a hefty ban. That dosen't mean that o' connell had the right to do what he did. By all means throw a couple back, but when he went to ground and continued throwing punches, that's beyond self-defence. Not only that but the ref had to tell o'connell to stop about 3 or 4 times. Had he being anywhere except thomond he would have been off.

[HappyMonday83]

So playing 20 phases in a row, was it Clermont playing the beautiful rugby?

Where did I say clermont played beautiful rugby?

I'm a toulouse man.

[Proinsias]

I agree 100% with everything you said except that bit. Punching someone who's not looking makes you a scumbag in my book and he deserves to get a hefty ban. That dosen't mean that o' connell had the right to do what he did. By all means throw a couple back, but when he went to ground and continued throwing punches, that's beyond self-defence. Not only that but the ref had to tell o'connell to stop about 3 or 4 times. Had he being anywhere except thomond he would have been off.
You have somewhat of a point but I think you're being harsh on O'Connell. Cudmore acted like a dick, he deserved a few digs. O'Connell was understandably pissed off. I reckon if O'Connell hadn't taken him to ground and thrown punches, he wouldn't have gotten a yellow. Punching back like that usually wouldn't merit it.

[HappyMonday83]

You have somewhat of a point but I think you're being harsh on O'Connell. Cudmore acted like a dick, he deserved a few digs. O'Connell was understandably pissed off. I reckon if O'Connell hadn't taken him to ground and thrown punches, he wouldn't have gotten a yellow. Punching back like that usually wouldn't merit it.

If i'm being honest, I probably would have done the same if I was in o'connell's position but I would have expected a red.

Holding a fella on the ground and unloading on him is not self-defense by any stretch of the imagination. For this reason he should have gotten red.

[Mick Lyons]

I believe George Hook compared Munsters performance the other night to the defence of Rorkes Drift .
Jesus wept.

[HappyMonday83]

I believe George Hook compared Munsters performance the other night to the defence of Rorkes Drift .
Jesus wept.

http://www.loungelightmedia .com/images/smilies/worf.gif

[Mick Lyons]

The guys really fronted up bigtime to the zulu's that day.

http://www.military-art.com/mall/images/dhm1494.jpg

[raZor]

If i'm being honest, I probably would have done the same if I was in o'connell's position but I would have expected a red.

Holding a fella on the ground and unloading on him is not self-defense by any stretch of the imagination. For this reason he should have gotten red.

Yet the SFI have a wankfest over McRae doing it to O'Gara and make him out to be some sort of hero.

The ref also pointed out that Cudmore continued with O'Callaghan and was spotted again by the linesman. There's been a few cases where the first puncher gets red, retaliator gets a yellow, normally its up to the interpratation of the referee.

[HappyMonday83]

Yet the SFI have a wankfest over McRae doing it to O'Gara and make him out to be some sort of hero.


That's because rog is a wanker.

[johnmcork]

Where did I say clermont played beautiful rugby?

I'm a toulouse man.

do you go see them often or just when the bandwagon sets off??;)

[raZor]

That's because rog is a wanker.

Classy! You're nearing Brad levels of losing the headidness here!

[raZor]

do you go see them often or just when the bandwagon sets off??;)

No he means in the sense that the teams he backs against Munster always manage to lose. ;)

[Arcadia]

do you go see them often or just when the bandwagon sets off??;)

Its costly and time consuming trying to follow all the teams that are up against Munster.

Way too many bandwagons to keep up with.

[Brad]

Connacht away and Ulster at home over the Crimbo/New Yrs period. Two victories there would be very possible and Munster would still be top of the Magners League - i wonder is this all a dream somedays.

[HappyMonday83]

Classy! You're nearing Brad levels of losing the headidness here!

All wumming aside. I've had dealings with rog and several other munster players through work and he's always come across as a bollix. I've yet to meet someone with a good word to say about him. O' Connell on the other hand is actually a lovely fella.

[HappyMonday83]

do you go see them often or just when the bandwagon sets off??;)

They play rugby the way I think it should be played.

[Brad]

All wumming aside. I've had dealings with rog and several other munster players through work and he's always come across as a bollix. I've yet to meet someone with a good word to say about him. O' Connell on the other hand is actually a lovely fella.

I didn't know they were full time posters on the PROC too.

[Arcadia]

All wumming aside. I've had dealings with rog and several other munster players through work and he's always come across as a bollix. I've yet to meet someone with a good word to say about him. O' Connell on the other hand is actually a lovely fella.

I have also had dealings with him through work very recently and no problems with him whatsoever.

Play the ball and not the man.

This is sport.

[HappyMonday83]

I have also had dealings with him through work very recently and no problems with him whatsoever.

Play the ball and not the man.

This is sport.

ROG has put himself in the public eye through methods other than his on the pitch activities. This opens him up for personal comment. I've met the guy a few times and given the choice I wouldn't have any dealings with him.

[Keith Talent]

Injustice seems to be the main thrust of this article...

http://www.lequipe.fr/Rugby/breves2008/20081213_182611_cler mont-a-frole-l-exploit.html


Exactly 100% correct on the article. They call it as if Clermont were very hard done by. The French media annoy me a bit like that but I suppose it happens everywhere.

I watched the coverage on French tv and the commentators were outraged at the decision. "It was inexplicable and without precedent". Bollox. I thought it was 100% correct. O'Connell was clearly hit with sneaky ones, called the attention of the linesman before he hit back. And as mentioned before, Cudmore then had a go with O' Callaghan.

I also think O' Connell came out on top and anyone who punches someone from behind deserves a good hiding (even if POC possibly went a little overboard on the ground)

The interesting thing with French rugby coverage, is they interview players on the sideline, usually as they are taken off. I hadn't seen it with a guy who had been red carded before but they interviewed Cudmore 5 minutes after the incident. He was still clearly fuming, hadn't calmed down at all and blamed O' Connell for kicking things off and said the linesman didn't see what started it. Bollox!!

[HappyMonday83]

Exactly 100% correct on the article. They call it as if Clermont were very hard done by. The French media annoy me a bit like that but I suppose it happens everywhere.

I watched the coverage on French tv and the commentators were outraged at the decision. "It was inexplicable and without precedent". Bollox. I thought it was 100% correct. O'Connell was clearly hit with sneaky ones, called the attention of the linesman before he hit back. And as mentioned before, Cudmore then had a go with O' Callaghan.

I also think O' Connell came out on top and anyone who punches someone from behind deserves a good hiding (even if POC possibly went a little overboard on the ground)

The interesting thing with French rugby coverage, is they interview players on the sideline, usually as they are taken off. I hadn't seen it with a guy who had been red carded before but they interviewed Cudmore 5 minutes after the incident. He was still clearly fuming, hadn't calmed down at all and blamed O' Connell for kicking things off and said the linesman didn't see what started it. Bollox!!
Well to be fair to cudmore, something had to have happened for him to throw his toys out of the pram.

[Matlock]

Well to be fair to cudmore, something had to have happened for him to throw his toys out of the pram.

Really?

Or is it just that you have to have some excuse to make this the fault of a Munster player? :rolleyes:

[HappyMonday83]

Really?

Or is it just that you have to have some excuse to make this the fault of a Munster player? :rolleyes:

Have you ever been at the bottom of a ruck mattie?

[STEVIEG]

Have you ever been at the bottom of a ruck mattie?

hey let's keep it to rugby

[Proinsias]

As I've said before, Cudmore has form. It's why he didn't play against Munster last year, got banned for a month for punching Tim Payne repeatedly.

He's got a dodgy past:

http://www.rugbyworldcup.co m/home/news/newsid=2006345.html
A decade ago the second row/flanker was the bill collector for a drug dealer in his hometown of Squamish in British Columbia on Canada's west coast.

He had several run-ins with police and served a year in a juvenile detention centre after being found guilty of assault.

Cudmore's name was also linked to a fatal attack that captured headlines across Canada, even though he wasn't directly involved in the incident.

With his family away, Cudmore held a party on New Year's Eve 1997 but he wasn't in the house when a neighbour came to investigate and was beaten to death by two men.

[HappyMonday83]

hey let's keep it to rugby

I could have said that she's lovely soft hands for a hooker.

[Matlock]

Have you ever been at the bottom of a ruck mattie?

Please dont try and run your "if you havent played a sport you cant comment on it" argument again - tis horseshit, in fairness.

[STEVIEG]

I could have said that she's lovely soft hands for a hooker.

FAO Matlock

sorry:)

keep fighting the good fight

[HappyMonday83]

Please dont try and run your "if you havent played a sport you cant comment on it" argument again - tis horseshit, in fairness.

It's a simple question mattie, it only requires a simple answer.

Have you ever been at the bottom of a ruck?

[Matlock]

It's a simple question mattie, it only requires a simple answer.

Have you ever been at the bottom of a ruck?

Yes.

[HappyMonday83]

Yes.

When is a ruck formed mattie?

[Mick Lyons]

What was it like?

[Matlock]

What was it like?

One of the best experiences of my young life...

[Mick Lyons]

Did anyone come in from the side?

[Keith Talent]

Have you ever been at the bottom of a ruck mattie?

Has Cudmore??? He should know how to deal with it.*



*not sneaky punches from behind (just in case)

[Matlock]

When is a ruck formed mattie?

When i am at the bottom of it.

Seriously, what is the point of this?

[HappyMonday83]

Has Cudmore??? He should know how to deal with it.*



*not sneaky punches from behind (just in case)

I agree cudmore is a scumbag, but am I expected to believe that he started throwing punches for no reason? Because in all my years i've never seen that happen before.

[HappyMonday83]

When i am at the bottom of it.

Seriously, what is the point of this?

The point is that you shouldn't be offering opinions on what you know nothing about.

[Keith Talent]

I agree cudmore is a scumbag, but am I expected to believe that he started throwing punches for no reason? Because in all my years i've never seen that happen before.

Ok, but (especially for a scumbag) those reasons do not always have to be foul play.

[HappyMonday83]

Ok, but (especially for a scumbag) those reasons do not always have to be foul play.

So what, one of the munster lads asked him was he going for pints later and he just started boxing?

[Matlock]

The point is that you shouldn't be offering opinions on what you know nothing about.

So it is your usual "anyone who doesnt play rugby cant comment on it" argument.

Tis still horseshit like, as arguments go.

I have no doubt that you know more about playing rugby than i do, that doesnt mean im not entitled to an opinion. That would akin to saying that unless you can play the piano you cant appreciate music.

It isnt difficult to figure out what happened here like, it isnt as if it relates to some little known or little understood rule of rugby. Cudmoer clattered O Connell, O Connell alerted the linesman and then clattered Cudmore back. You believe he should have got a red card. You also believe that he must have done something to deserve the clattering from Cudmore. In my opinion you are incapable of giving an unbiased opinion in relation to a game that Munster are involved in. You need ( for some bizarre reason) to be able to come on here and bitch about them, so if you cant bitch about them losing you will bitch about how they won.

Finally, it is entirely possible that i have been involved in more rucks with rugby players than you have...

:p

[Arcadia]

So it is your usual "anyone who doesnt play rugby cant comment on it" argument.

Tis still horseshit like, as arguments go.

I have no doubt that you know more about playing rugby than i do, that doesnt mean im not entitled to an opinion. That would akin to saying that unless you can play the piano you cant appreciate music.

It isnt difficult to figure out what happened here like, it isnt as if it relates to some little known or little understood rule of rugby. Cudmoer clattered O Connell, O Connell alerted the linesman and then clattered Cudmore back. You believe he should have got a red card. You also believe that he must have done something to deserve the clattering from Cudmore. In my opinion you are incapable of giving an unbiased opinion in relation to a game that Munster are involved in. You need ( for some bizarre reason) to be able to come on here and bitch about them, so if you cant bitch about them losing you will bitch about how they won.

Finally, it is entirely possible that i have been involved in more rucks with rugby players than you have...

:p


Nail on head.

[Actin The Sham]

Finally, it is entirely possible that i have been involved in more rucks with rugby players than you have...

:p

http://www.georgiecasey.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/ogara_felling_tit.jp g

[Matlock]

http://www.georgiecasey.com/wp-content/uploads/2006/11/ogara_felling_tit.jp g

ATS, if you really think i look anything like either or those girls then im am insulted.

Fierce insulted like...

[Actin The Sham]

ATS, if you really think i look anything like either or those girls then im am insulted.

Fierce insulted like...


I didn't say anything.

I know you are way better looking then them.

[Keith Talent]

So what, one of the munster lads asked him was he going for pints later and he just started boxing?


POC is a big player with a big reputation. He's taken many players who are a lot better than this journeyman Cudmore to school. How many times do you see an alsoran like this guy lose the plot, because he can't compete in the game, lashing out to try to get one up in anyway he can. A lot. Frustration is very often the cause of ugly incidents.

I won't pretend to know what happened at the ruck, but what I've said is a real possibility. Problem for this guy, is that he did it in a sneaky way, and was still taken to school for his troubles.


Whatever about this incident, which I think the ref called right, Munster showed that securing possession against them isn't enough (even for a top top team) to beat them. You have to be clinical and take all your chances. Because Munster, with their experience and winning attitude, will take theirs.

[HappyMonday83]

So it is your usual "anyone who doesnt play rugby cant comment on it" argument.

Tis still horseshit like, as arguments go.

I have no doubt that you know more about playing rugby than i do, that doesnt mean im not entitled to an opinion. That would akin to saying that unless you can play the piano you cant appreciate music.

It isnt difficult to figure out what happened here like, it isnt as if it relates to some little known or little understood rule of rugby. Cudmoer clattered O Connell, O Connell alerted the linesman and then clattered Cudmore back. You believe he should have got a red card. You also believe that he must have done something to deserve the clattering from Cudmore. In my opinion you are incapable of giving an unbiased opinion in relation to a game that Munster are involved in. You need ( for some bizarre reason) to be able to come on here and bitch about them, so if you cant bitch about them losing you will bitch about how they won.

Finally, it is entirely possible that i have been involved in more rucks with rugby players than you have...

:p
You've raised a number of points. Firstly if you've no experience of rucking then you have no business talking about it. It's like a priest offering marriage advice, he doesn't know what he talking about and neither do you.

Secondly, why did cudmore start throwing punches? I've been playing and watching rugby for a good while now and i've never seen a player start boxing like that for no reason. I don't condone his actions, i'm merely stating that something happened in that ruck that he took exception to.

Finally, I've hit more rucks than you've had hot dinners.

[HappyMonday83]

POC is a big player with a big reputation. He's taken many players who are a lot better than this journeyman Cudmore to school. How many times do you see an alsoran like this guy lose the plot, because he can't compete in the game, lashing out to try to get one up in anyway he can. A lot. Frustration is very often the cause of ugly incidents.

I won't pretend to know what happened at the ruck, but what I've said is a real possibility. Problem for this guy, is that he did it in a sneaky way, and was still taken to school for his troubles.


Whatever about this incident, which I think the ref called right, Munster showed that securing possession against them isn't enough (even for a top top team) to beat them. You have to be clinical and take all your chances. Because Munster, with their experience and winning attitude, will take theirs.
Cudmore was doing some serious boxing. A lot more than someone who was frustrated (besides I highly doubt he was frustrated as clermont were well on top).

If you want to "get" a player you don't start boxing in front of the ref, you do it in a ruck. I'd say cudmore knows this more than most.

[ANVIL]

Whether anything was said or done to Cudmore is irrelevant.
The ref blew his whistle - he carried on punching and O'Connell retaliated to defend himself.
The incident happened in front of the ref and touch judge who both agreed on the action taken.
What's of more concern to Munster must be the fact that it took them so long to overcome 14 men.
But that and the Harlequins match that followed made for a great afternoon's rugby in the company of many pints of porter.

[HappyMonday83]

Whether anything was said or done to Cudmore is irrelevant.
The ref blew his whistle - he carried on punching and O'Connell retaliated to defend himself.
The incident happened in front of the ref and touch judge who both agreed on the action taken.
What's of more concern to Munster must be the fact that it took them so long to overcome 14 men.
But that and the Harlequins match that followed made for a great afternoon's rugby in the company of many pints of porter.

The ref also blew his whistle 4 or 5 times at o'connell telling him to stop punching. So why didn't he see red?

[Matlock]

You've raised a number of points. Firstly if you've no experience of rucking then you have no business talking about it. It's like a priest offering marriage advice, he doesn't know what he talking about and neither do you.

Secondly, why did cudmore start throwing punches? I've been playing and watching rugby for a good while now and i've never seen a player start boxing like that for no reason. I don't condone his actions, i'm merely stating that something happened in that ruck that he took exception to.

Finally, I've hit more rucks than you've had hot dinners.

Bollocks, plain and simple. You try and use the "i play rugby" line around here in an attempt to bolster your woefully weak arguments. I dont accept it. Bite me.

As for why Cudmore started throwing punches, fucked if i know. Fucked if you know either though - i just find it interesting that when a Munster player gets punched your immediate reaction is to try and find a way to blame himn for it.

[ANVIL]

The ref also blew his whistle 4 or 5 times at o'connell telling him to stop punching. So why didn't he see red?

I think the fact that Cudmore actually started up again after the whistle got him the red and the fact that O'Connell hadn't been seen to throw any punches up until then earned him a yellow.
Besides, what's the point in sending off a man from each side - it defeats the object.

[Keith Talent]

Cudmore was doing some serious boxing. A lot more than someone who was frustrated (besides I highly doubt he was frustrated as clermont were well on top).

If you want to "get" a player you don't start boxing in front of the ref, you do it in a ruck. I'd say cudmore knows this more than most.

A bit early and still 0-0 but I do take your point. I was more talking about the individual battles though and POC is one on the big boys in world rugby in his position. In any case, it seems to me, from the replay that it boiled over a little from both sides just before the incident. Also, there was an awful lot of hostility after last week. The ref clearly says "you continued punching" (I assume for the afters on O' Callaghan) and took action.

The bottom line, is that while the game was extremely worrying from a Munster point of view (dominated by 14) the essentially knocked out a major rival and one of the toughest teams in Europe.

Agree with Anv-ey. An excellent Saturday afternoon entertainment over a few pints.

[Mick Lyons]

Bollocks, plain and simple. You try and use the "i play rugby" line around here in an attempt to bolster your woefully weak arguments. I dont accept it. Bite me.

As for why Cudmore started throwing punches, fucked if i know. Fucked if you know either though - i just find it interesting that when a Munster player gets punched your immediate reaction is to try and find a way to blame himn for it.

If you've never been bitten at the bottom of a ruck you've no business talking about it.

[Keith Talent]

I think the fact that Cudmore actually started up again after the whistle got him the red and the fact that O'Connell hadn't been seen to throw any punches up until then earned him a yellow.
Besides, what's the point in sending off a man from each side - it defeats the object.

Agree with this 100%. Seems to be exactly what the ref said too.


I do think it is legitimate to send two players off (in other circumstances) though. Sometimes got to say, can't tolerate it, off to both. Sets the tone for other players too.

[BlackAvon08]

For me two yellow cards would have been the right call – and we wouldn’t be talking about the incident now.

[HappyMonday83]

Bollocks, plain and simple. You try and use the "i play rugby" line around here in an attempt to bolster your woefully weak arguments. I dont accept it. Bite me.

As for why Cudmore started throwing punches, fucked if i know. Fucked if you know either though - i just find it interesting that when a Munster player gets punched your immediate reaction is to try and find a way to blame himn for it.

Mattie dear, i'm merely telling you the truth. If you have no experience then you've no ground to stand on this applies to anything not just rugby.

I've no medical background so I don't claim that my opinion carries any weight when it come to medicine. The same go's for everything be it law, engineering, golf, rugby etc.

I don't know exactly why cudmore started boxing, but I am sure that something happened in that ruck that set him off.

[HappyMonday83]

I think the fact that Cudmore actually started up again after the whistle got him the red and the fact that O'Connell hadn't been seen to throw any punches up until then earned him a yellow.
Besides, what's the point in sending off a man from each side - it defeats the object.

If you throw a punch on the pitch you're supposed to get red.
O' Connell threw at least 7 or 8.

[Keith Talent]

For me two yellow cards would have been the right call – and we wouldn’t be talking about the incident now.

Probably would have been the case had the guy not started up with O' Callaghan.

You're right though. This incident is irrelevant. Clermont sent out and Munster still on course.

[HappyMonday83]

If you've never been bitten at the bottom of a ruck you've no business talking about it.

It happens more than you'd think.

[Matlock]

Mattie dear, i'm merely telling you the truth. If you have no experience then you've no ground to stand on this applies to anything not just rugby.

I've no medical background so I don't claim that my opinion carries any weight when it come to medicine. The same go's for everything be it law, engineering, golf, rugby etc.

I don't know exactly why cudmore started boxing, but I am sure that something happened in that ruck that set him off.

Conjecture, my dear boy and nothing more than conjecture. It doesnt make a blind bit if difference if you hae experience playing rugby or not you cant know what happened in the ruck.

This is nothing more than you looking for something to whine about because Munster won. I bet you had a grin like a cheshire cat with 5 minutes to go, getting all excited about the gloating you could do on here if Munster lost. Jaysis, the disapointment must be killing ya :p

[Keith Talent]

Mattie dear, i'm merely telling you the truth. If you have no experience then you've no ground to stand on this applies to anything not just rugby.

I've no medical background so I don't claim that my opinion carries any weight when it come to medicine. The same go's for everything be it law, engineering, golf, rugby etc.

I don't know exactly why cudmore started boxing, but I am sure that something happened in that ruck that set him off.


I don't think comparing medicine and taking an interest in and following rugby is the way forward for you in this (pointless -better to share opinions on rugby that argue about who should have them) discussion.


You play for an amateur rugby team yeah?

Do you know any amateur doctors? A class twice a week and a surgery on a sunday afternoon. Then down the pub.

:rolleyes::rolleyes:

[Proinsias]

Having watched the clip a few times, HM, you're bullshitting.

1. It wasn't quite a ruck. Only one player from the munster side, lying on the ground. If you look, when the commentator says "Mignoni", after the ref blew his whistle the first couple of times, Cudmore is slowly sauntering over to the ruck.

He then gets his hands on whoever is on the ground.

O'Connell comes through, rucking-style and shoves him out of it.

That's what happened in the "ruck". He got pushed out.

I've been playing rugby for 20 years and in that time, I've been punched dozens of times for no apparent reason. I'm mostly a clean player.

Some players are just plain idiots. Cudmore appears to be one.

[Proinsias]

I don't think comparing medicine and taking an interest in and following rugby is the way forward for you in this (pointless -better to share opinions on rugby that argue about who should have them) discussion.


You play for an amateur rugby team yeah?

Do you know any amateur doctors? A class twice a week and a surgery on a sunday afternoon. Then down the pub.

:rolleyes::rolleyes:

I've done a first aid course...

[raZor]

It wasnt a ruck Horan tackled Mignoni and whilst doing so the whistle went some Clermont players didnt like (I presume) the tackle, went in and Muster players went in, Cudmore was just being a prick and was put back in his place.

[Matlock]

Having watched the clip a few times, HM, you're bullshitting.

1. It wasn't quite a ruck. Only one player from the munster side, lying on the ground. If you look, when the commentator says "Mignoni", after the ref blew his whistle the first couple of times, Cudmore is slowly sauntering over to the ruck.

He then gets his hands on whoever is on the ground.

O'Connell comes through, rucking-style and shoves him out of it.

That's what happened in the "ruck". He got pushed out.

I've been playing rugby for 20 years and in that time, I've been punched dozens of times for no apparent reason. I'm mostly a clean player.

Some players are just plain idiots. Cudmore appears to be one.

Oh, oh, oh HM look - it is a boy and a rugby playing boy at that ^^^^^^^

Will you accept his opinions as valid??

:rolleyes:

[raZor]

I've done a first aid course...

I'm not a gynocoligist (sp?) but I'll have a look.

[Arcadia]

Having watched the clip a few times, HM, you're bullshitting.

1. It wasn't quite a ruck. Only one player from the munster side, lying on the ground. If you look, when the commentator says "Mignoni", after the ref blew his whistle the first couple of times, Cudmore is slowly sauntering over to the ruck.

He then gets his hands on whoever is on the ground.

O'Connell comes through, rucking-style and shoves him out of it.

That's what happened in the "ruck". He got pushed out.

I've been playing rugby for 20 years and in that time, I've been punched dozens of times for no apparent reason. I'm mostly a clean player.

Some players are just plain idiots. Cudmore appears to be one.

Cudmore is an idiot and has form.

Even if he was provoked he was very stupid to do in fron of Ref and then to throw a few at DOC in fron of all to see.

He let himself and his team down.....again.

Entertaining afternoon though.

[Keith Talent]

Having watched the clip a few times, HM, you're bullshitting.

1. It wasn't quite a ruck. Only one player from the munster side, lying on the ground. If you look, when the commentator says "Mignoni", after the ref blew his whistle the first couple of times, Cudmore is slowly sauntering over to the ruck.

He then gets his hands on whoever is on the ground.

O'Connell comes through, rucking-style and shoves him out of it.

That's what happened in the "ruck". He got pushed out.

I've been playing rugby for 20 years and in that time, I've been punched dozens of times for no apparent reason. I'm mostly a clean player.

Some players are just plain idiots. Cudmore appears to be one.

I also watched the clip again a few times following this discussion and I agree with that 100%. That's exactly what I saw too.

[Keith Talent]

I've done a first aid course...

Sure. Just saying you should compare like with like. Don't think you need a qualification (on any level) to be a rugby fan.

[HappyMonday83]

Conjecture, my dear boy and nothing more than conjecture. It doesnt make a blind bit if difference if you hae experience playing rugby or not you cant know what happened in the ruck.

This is nothing more than you looking for something to whine about because Munster won. I bet you had a grin like a cheshire cat with 5 minutes to go, getting all excited about the gloating you could do on here if Munster lost. Jaysis, the disapointment must be killing ya :p

I believe that I would be considered to be an expert witness, thus what i've said would be taken into account.

The only people who know what happened were those in the ruck, but anyone who's played the game will recognize that reaction a mile off. When fellas come out of a scrum or a ruck punching it's not because they were tickling each-other.

[Matlock]

I believe that I would be considered to be an expert witness, thus what i've said would be taken into account.

The only people who know what happened were those in the ruck, but anyone who's played the game will recognize that reaction a mile off. When fellas come out of a scrum or a ruck punching it's not because they were tickling each-other.

I believe you would be considered an amature witness...

[BlackAvon08]

I must disagree with the subtext that someone can’t hold an informed opinion on a sport without having physically played the sport. In fact HappyMonday83 has gone as far as suggesting that someone can’t hold a valid opinion on any subject without holding a relevant degree!

While nothing beats the real life experience of playing a sport, I suggest that it is quiet possible to form and develop reasonable opinions on a sport should someone have the interest to follow & inform themselves on the sport in question.

In the case of a field game such as rugby I believe it would be possible for someone to become a top class referee without having played the game at all. A referee needs have a sound grasp of the rules, the ability to apply the rules with impartiality, fairness and commonsense and to keep a cool head in all circumstances. Come to think of it, these would be attributes common among high flyers in the legal world. I take it that Matlock is a legal eagle – any interest in blazing a trail for budding female Rugby referees??

[HappyMonday83]

Having watched the clip a few times, HM, you're bullshitting.

1. It wasn't quite a ruck. Only one player from the munster side, lying on the ground. If you look, when the commentator says "Mignoni", after the ref blew his whistle the first couple of times, Cudmore is slowly sauntering over to the ruck.

He then gets his hands on whoever is on the ground.

O'Connell comes through, rucking-style and shoves him out of it.

That's what happened in the "ruck". He got pushed out.

I've been playing rugby for 20 years and in that time, I've been punched dozens of times for no apparent reason. I'm mostly a clean player.

Some players are just plain idiots. Cudmore appears to be one.

That clip shows nothing frank. From the best angle all you can see is o'connells back. All you can see is o'connell running in one side and by the time he comes out the other cudmore is well and truly pissed off. I'm not defending cudmore by any means but i'm fairly sure there was a bit more than pushing going on. He acted like that everytime someone pushed him in a ruck I doubt he'd still be playing rugby.

[liam2me]

I must disagree with the subtext that someone can’t hold an informed opinion on a sport without having physically played the sport. In fact HappyMonday83 has gone as far as suggesting that someone can’t hold a valid opinion on any subject without holding a relevant degree!

While nothing beats the real life experience of playing a sport, I suggest that it is quiet possible to form and develop reasonable opinions on a sport should someone have the interest to follow & inform themselves on the sport in question.

In the case of a field game such as rugby I believe it would be possible for someone to become a top class referee without having played the game at all. A referee needs have a sound grasp of the rules, the ability to apply the rules with impartiality, fairness and commonsense and to keep a cool head in all circumstances. Come to think of it, these would be attributes common among high flyers in the legal world. I take it that Matlock is a legal eagle – any interest in blazing a trail for budding female Rugby referees??
FFS don't talk sense to that lot, they'll be confused and just go off in a huff

[Actin The Sham]

I must disagree with the subtext that someone can’t hold an informed opinion on a sport without having physically played the sport. In fact HappyMonday83 has gone as far as suggesting that someone can’t hold a valid opinion on any subject without holding a relevant degree!

While nothing beats the real life experience of playing a sport, I suggest that it is quiet possible to form and develop reasonable opinions on a sport should someone have the interest to follow & inform themselves on the sport in question.

In the case of a field game such as rugby I believe it would be possible for someone to become a top class referee without having played the game at all. A referee needs have a sound grasp of the rules, the ability to apply the rules with impartiality, fairness and commonsense and to keep a cool head in all circumstances. Come to think of it, these would be attributes common among high flyers in the legal world. I take it that Matlock is a legal eagle – any interest in blazing a trail for budding female Rugby referees??


Naff has never driven a Formula 1 car, yet he thinks Lewis Hamilton is "a fuckin legend."

He drives an x-trail.

[liam2me]

That clip shows nothing frank. From the best angle all you can see is o'connells back. All you can see is o'connell running in one side and by the time he comes out the other cudmore is well and truly pissed off. I'm not defending cudmore by any means but i'm fairly sure there was a bit more than pushing going on. He acted like that everytime someone pushed him in a ruck I doubt he'd still be playing rugby.
he got a nasty ban last year for something just a stupid against wasps. the guy has a history of it

[johnmcork]

I believe that I would be considered to be an expert witness, thus what i've said would be taken into account.

The only people who know what happened were those in the ruck, but anyone who's played the game will recognize that reaction a mile off. When fellas come out of a scrum or a ruck punching it's not because they were tickling each-other.

cudmore came in for afters pure and simple. do you think o'connell should have just taken the beating and done nothing? if you think that the philosophy at charleville rfc must have changed quite a bit since i played with them. also, o'connel was bleeding and cudmore looked unscathed. it doesn't matter if his mother was insulted, if he got a sneaky slap or whatever, his reaction was mental, over the top and he'll be cited so all your personal rucking experience won't matter a bit when the erc get hold of him.

also; i can drive a car so, obviously, i know exactly how to win at silverstone

[HappyMonday83]

I must disagree with the subtext that someone can’t hold an informed opinion on a sport without having physically played the sport. In fact HappyMonday83 has gone as far as suggesting that someone can’t hold a valid opinion on any subject without holding a relevant degree!

While nothing beats the real life experience of playing a sport, I suggest that it is quiet possible to form and develop reasonable opinions on a sport should someone have the interest to follow & inform themselves on the sport in question.

In the case of a field game such as rugby I believe it would be possible for someone to become a top class referee without having played the game at all. A referee needs have a sound grasp of the rules, the ability to apply the rules with impartiality, fairness and commonsense and to keep a cool head in all circumstances. Come to think of it, these would be attributes common among high flyers in the legal world. I take it that Matlock is a legal eagle – any interest in blazing a trail for budding female Rugby referees??

So do you think everyone has a valid opinion on every topic?

All i'm saying is that if you have no experience in an area then you shouldn't talk about it.